Opinion on SS Panzer M42 Tunic

**youthcollector1** · 08-10-2013, 12:20 AM

by BenVK

I'm very puzzled by the way you guys all go about authenticating a tunic. It seems very random.

I would like to know:

1. Is the base tunic original?
2. Are all the insignia by themselves original items.
3. Are the insignia sewn to the tunic in a manor that would be deemed original?
4. If you agree that they have, what is your expertise in knowing what period sewing looks like?

I agree Ben so,
1. I believe so
2. Once again, I believe so.
3. It is of my opinion the cuff title is original to the tunic. I don't believe, however, the rest of the insignia is but these things are best examined in hand. It's really hard to determine, at least for me, and to be completely positive either way, especially with the provided photographs.
4. I spend the majority of my time studying tunics and I have some which are restored as well as not, but I am still learning hints why I never state my opinion as facts.

Barbander, what is it that makes you think this is a complete copy? It is new looking is irrelevant in my opinion. I've seen period items which look like they were made yesterday, and copies made yesterday that look 70yrs old. Francesco, good catch, that slipped my mind, too. Here is a good link for ranks and etc. Wehrmacht Rank

I am also on my phone, which is not the best source for determining authenticity by the provided images.

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 08-10-2013 12:20 AM

We also buy and trade your items and full collections!

**Bochmann** · 08-10-2013, 02:20 AM

For info, this tunic has already been commented on previously.
It is easy to remember because of the green piped straps which are wrong for GVB but apparently came with the tunic.
I do not have a problem with any of it (apart from the conflicting/contentious shoulder straps) but I do not know how you confirm that the insignia is original to the tunic based on internet pictures, that is just a few steps too advanced for me..........?
However, I do like the tunic.

**youthcollector1** · 08-10-2013, 02:28 AM

by Bochmann

For info, this tunic has already been commented on previously.
It is easy to remember because of the green piped straps which are wrong for GVB but apparently came with the tunic.
I do not have a problem with any of it (apart from the conflicting/contentious shoulder straps) but I do not know how you confirm that the insignia is original to the tunic based on internet pictures, that is just a few steps too advanced for me..........?
However, I do like the tunic.

Can you please provided us with a link, and in regards to the insignia, their are times when a tunic which has been restored it's very noticeable, even in pictures, but the majority of time it is best to examine these in hand. IMO, this tunic shows signs of being restored, i.e stitching, wear correlation, settling of the insignia, and the shoulder boards were more than likely added post-war which is quite easily done and almost impossible to determine with these slip-on boards.

**North of 55** · 08-10-2013, 02:30 AM

second that.

Thanks

**North of 55** · 08-10-2013, 02:45 AM

Here are a few more of shoulder board.

**Bochmann** · 08-10-2013, 02:53 AM

https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/ss-un...unic-210317-2/

Have attached link but I do not know if this will work.
I found the previous entry by putting "Goetz von" into the search box and found it straight away.

**Larry C** · 08-10-2013, 03:04 AM

I dont want to do any nit picking but in this hobby especially in the SS realm...it is imperative to "knowing so" than "believing so"..this could cost thousands of dollars which may be misleading..to the semi proficient collector. For me if I had to guess..It would be best for me to say nothing at all.
In learning there are lumps to be taken ,as I have found this out the hard way...which just strengthened my resolve to put more focus into study.
In this hobby we should be leaning towards to being surgeons of History...one thing I abhor is science and theory,,which most of it is based on guessing. When there is History and money involved there is no margin for error.
For those who were in this hobby before I was born..I commend you as you are the first generation of collectors and closest to the front line of truth. As years passed the truth becomes watered down and less studied. I myself would lean on 2 ideals..one would be a hands on study... and two..complimented with a mentoring senior of the first collecting generation.
I hope what I have said would be taken as constructive and meant to remind those to stay focused..We are the next in line to teach those below us especially some of our younger well planted members / collectors. If we sway in a wide curve away form the truth ..overtime..we ourselves will be to blame and eventually be called deniers..as our knowledge will either make or break our integrity to the now and future collecting community. I am grateful to my Edged Weapon mentors as I could never accumulate in such a short time what they have spent learning in the last 6 or 7 decades.
Time and patience built this hobby

**Friedrich-Berthold** · 08-10-2013, 03:08 AM

by Larry C

I dont want to do any nit picking but in this hobby especially in the SS realm...it is imperative to "knowing so" than "believing so"..this could cost thousands of dollars which may be misleading..to the semi proficient collector. For me if I had to guess..It would be best for me to say nothing at all.
In learning there are lumps to be taken ,as I have found this out the hard way...which just strengthened my resolve to put more focus into study.
In this hobby we should be leaning towards to being surgeons of History...one thing I abhor is science and theory,,which most of it is based on guessing. When there is History and money involved there is no margin for error.
For those who were in this hobby before I was born..I commend you as you are the first generation of collectors and closest to the front line of truth. As years passed the truth becomes watered down and less studied. I myself would lean on 2 ideals..one would be a hands on study... and two..complimented with a mentoring senior of the first collecting generation.
I hope what I have said would be taken as constructive and meant to remind those to stay focused..We are the next in line to teach those below us especially some of our younger well planted members / collectors. If we sway in a wide curve away form the truth ..overtime..we ourselves will be to blame and eventually be called deniers..as our knowledge will either make or break our integrity to the now and future collecting community. I am grateful to my Edged Weapon mentors as I could never accumulate in such a short time what they have spent learning in the last 6 or 7 decades.
Time and patience built this hobby

Well said and an insightful essay.

**North of 55** · 08-10-2013, 03:17 AM

Bochmann Thanks for the link, it helped shed some light, Also Larry well spoken, Also thanks for everyone's input greatly appreciated. After doing some home work, I have decided to pass on this tunic.

Regards

Mario

**Friedrich-Berthold** · 08-10-2013, 03:20 AM

Patience and time have lost meaning today, I guess, and the collateral damage is legion.
The capability to put in the key word and have a jumble of things emerge, most of which is drivel and some of which is of merit is joined with the affect of boundless self esteem to produce a crack up.
I still spend quiet hours with my lupe in hand, myself, on my back, (or hanging from the ceiling, which I sometimes do in a moment of reflection...) minutely examining my things for the little, subtle secrets that seldom if ever are visible in these digital shadows and flash of light which do or do not really tell us anything.

A senior collector allowed me recently to examine a wonderful cap, the first pictures of which betrayed to me, at least, a questionable piece. In reality, however, it was a once in a life time item. That is, the pictures were deceptive, which they can well be and proffer no real answer. Sometimes they do, but in a case of this type, the only thing to do is to adhere to Ben's strictures.

I find the whole gamut of grey field blouses to be a fun house hall of mirrors, but some here have earned their right to say through the exact kind of study that Mr. Larry has extolled.