I attached a more detailed picture of the back. Please note the remants of black uv-neg. thread, where the eagle was sewn onto a cap. Also note the sewing/sticking marks on the black paper backing.
Again, thanks for your help so far.
Voila, from my friend, David Delich
".....In all of my years of collecting, I have seen very few SS bullion-
embroidered cap eagles that I thought were real. All of those
I have seen were made somewhat differently, just as all
bullion-embroidered sleeve eagles vary somewhat. To say
one is not authentic when compared to others that may vary
somewhat is not a fair comparison. This true when considering
hand-embroidered specimens that are likely to vary due to
the human factor. There may have been very few made because
the use of woven examples were cheaper to make and/or preferred
by the wearer. This is speculation, of course. There has to be a
reason that nearly zero examples are to be seen in original photos.
The two examples that I have seen that may have, in my mind,
a chance of being authentic is the one at the top of p. 456 of
Angolia's Cloth Insignia of the SS, 2nd ed. The eagle beneath
the one pictured is my own example. The photo of Sheffler's
eagle measures exactly the same as mine (68mm X 33mm),
which doesn't prove anything in itself -- just thought it was
an interesting circumstance.
At any rate, even these two examples bear varying features,
which they have a right to display, according to the desires of
the artist concerned. That doesn't make either of them good
The example in the forum, therefore, may be authentic and
may vary (but compared to what?) again, vary according to
the embroiderer. It's a but cruder, but I've explained why
that may be.
I am open to view any original close up photos that anyone
may be willing to submit of an undisputedly original SS cap
eagle in bullion for the education of all..."
and thanks to my friend Arran for his fine analysis, as well.
I am no expert in this material.
Happy collecting to all...
In 1970, I bought an authentic grey SS peaked cap for the officer which had a not dissimilar cap eagle which I showed to Andrew Mollo, who deemed it a fake. I removed the embroidered badge and replaced it with a metal badge. The cap cost all of eighty dollars in 1970, which was a fortune.
I wish I had the cap. It was quite real, but had been tampered with. This experience some forty five years ago remains fresh in my mind,
and also caused my doubts here. I defer to those whom I respect whose presence here makes this site unique.
Thank you for showing this to your friend Mr. Delich. Is there a chance I could send him over the eagle for an in hand inspection?
One observation I would like to add. This one in the for sale section looks like a nice original to me. If you have a closer look, you might notice quite a few similarities, which I find very odd:
1. The Unterlagen look exactly the same
2. For the wings a very detailed thread was used, note the rectangular shape of the thrad
3. Note the material that was used for the swaz. It looks like the same material was used. Also the coloring of the "Unterlagen" look the same.
I am not in denial here, but I seriously doubt that this eagle is a fake. Again, if it would be possible to send this eagle to Mr. Delich, I would gladly ship it to him.
Mr. Delich wrote that It could be original or could be fake. For me It is and stays original.
Landsknecht the picture you used is a armeagle and yes It has similarities.
yes I noticed it is an armeagle (and quite a nice one), but I found the similarities in the used material quite astonishing. That´s why I highlighted some of the similar features. I think it would be quite unusual if the fakers would use these exact materials.
I also quite like this eagle. It will stay in my collection.
Thanks for all the replies.
Very interesting thread indeed