Very Early Standartenfuhrer Collar Tabs

[Friedrich-Berthold]

Here is what my mentor has to say, and he kindly included some items from his Schatzkammer.

We all thank him warmly for this courtesy, and so many others.


"....Schreck is, indeed, wearing a pair of aluminum hand-
embroidered Standartenfuhrer tabs. Any metal oak leaves
would have been the same type utilized by the SA, such as
those the man in the 2nd photo is wearing.
I've included several early-style pre-'42 style collar
patches for your friend's examination.
Note how the person who embroidered the early
Standartenfuhrer tab embroidered the oak leaf into
the collar tabs only after the edges of the material had been
folded back. I have several example of this method of
manufacture. Also, on the early Brigadefuhrer in the
lower left-hand corner, the pip was obviously added to an
Oberfuhrer tab when the man achieved a higher rank.
In reference to this, I once again draw your attention to
the man in the forum that is wearing metal oak leaves --
he may very well have had the metal rank star added to
his tab for the same reason.
I had an embroidered early pre-'42 tab once (an
Oberfuhrer) that had a metal star added to the corner,,
even though the leaves were embroidered aluminum.
Obviously, all vet bring-back insignia was not text-
book as some collectors seem to think they ought to be...."

[Friedrich-Berthold]

A wonderful thread from our finest members!

[d'alquen]

Arran,
This is the earliest style of metal oak leaf that I have seen on SA collar tabs, (the only other stamped metal style I have come across is the later version with the acorns at the stem), and it differs in shape from the SS leaf in your picture. Both this SA photo and the Schreck portrait were taken by Hoffmann in the same time period (late 1933). I think I have a photograph of the style shown in your post that shows differing stem lengths that would tend to indicate hand embroidery. I will try and find that shot and post it.

[Wilhelm Saris]

Nice close-up d'Alquen. This style of leaf for the SA was adopted from the Reichsbahn
and was known as the first form, proceeded in about 1933 with the form for the SA,
which we in general know. I was given a hint for this by a good Dutch friend and collector,
who is well-known with the SA.
The Reichsbahn device was introduced in about 1924 (see photo's, credit: Hartmut Schöttge).



Additional information:
Not topic in relation for the device for the SS, but interesting to know.
Standartenführer for the SA did wear since 1926 four pips (SA-Befehl 12 from November 12,
1926). A leaf was not worn at all for years. As far as I know the leaf as shown here came into
being with an order from April 22, 1931 (OSAF-order Ia Nr. 1679/31), existing in silver and
gold.
With an order from July 31, 1933 (OSAF-order I Nr. 1404 33 II.Ang) the new device for
Standartenführer was announced. The RZM had to take care for a quickest manufacturing.
The old device was allowed to be worn until October 1, 1933. See image for the new device:

[HPL2008]

Fascinating.

I had never noticed the similiarity between these early SA oak leaf devices and those used for the 1924 model Reichsbahn collar patches and would probably have never made the mental connection necessary to even consider comparing them...

Thanks to everyone involved in what is another brilliant little thread!

[Arran]

Thank you ALL for participating in this thread. I now believe that both sets of tabs in the pics I posted are aluminum embroidered, and of the type shown in the upper left of Mr. Delich's lovely collection in post 11. This pattern of Standartenfuhrer's oak leaf is most appealing in its asymmetry and natural appearance, and I believe this thread is the first time its been clearly documented. Note also that it appears to be embroidered on wool rather than velvet (please correct me if I'm wrong).

[d'alquen]

You are correct Arran, the base of the collar tab is wool. You can see it in this close-up of the picture you posted. As I mentioned, the photograph was taken sometime in late '33 and the velvet backing was not introduced until December 1, 1933.

Der Reichsfuehrer-SS
IV Tgb.Nr.49 103
Muenchen, 1 Dezember 1933
Die Spiegel der SS-Dienstgrade vom SS-Standartenfuehrer einschliesslich nach oben sind anstatt aus schwarzem Tuch aus schwarzen Samt.

[Friedrich-Berthold]

When the moderators get a chance, this thread should be added to the pinned reference section, please.

[Wilhelm Saris]

See additional information to post 14, which I added later (for the interest
of those for the SA). It all came to me during a short investigation for the
device as used by the Zeugmeister. For this I keep it in embargo, as
my friend is working for a book about SA devices (collar-patches and such).

[Friedrich-Berthold]

See additional information to post 14, which I added later (for the interest
of those for the SA).

Wonderful. Thank you all so much. Thanks to Arran for his fine idea for this thread. He is a person of great knowledge and refined taste.

Thanks for the exemplary collaboration.