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Waffen -SS elite troops?

Article about: I've been thinking about the structure of SS. I have some points about it. The SS TV and SS VT was a elite troops with their own structure, supply etc which was highest quality. After 1942 y

  1. #11


    Please name some titles Friedrich-Berthold

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  3. #12


    I have made these suggestions hundreds of times, so please just re-read my older posts.
    damit, basta.

  4. #13


    A study of contemporaney armies effectuated by Jewish army determined the WSS as the best army in the contemporaney history.
    I think this is all.
    For sure is not only 1 2 3 5 div but many others as said moreover is not only a question of equipment but also situations chances of victory and number and quality of opponents.

  5. #14


    Quote by Dimas View Post
    For example, who is the better soldier:
    Wehrmacht educated officer ( in family generation with a military traditions) who recieved military education from the childhood, or even a Feldwebel with 12 years service.
    Or an "redneck" farmer who have not even a school graduate, and then 3 months of training camps? Could this redneck a good tank driver or a flyer?
    Also that is not a secret that some of the units which was created from Eastern Freiwilligen upholded with the highest awards.
    For example: Danish volunteers and Latvian volunteers. Even over the different kampaigns, hard battles in Wolchow front- Demjansk etc, there was no Knights Cross recipients in Danish units untill 1944 year.( I did not think they was not brave men, they was fight anought good, just a policy for recipient was different )
    In most cases Legions in the 3rd Reich was not a elite troops but a conscript and militia like troops
    That is the same as in French foreign Legion in the period of French operation - they have a very low morale and military education
    Any thoughts are welcome
    As for the volounteers from Denmark, they were just that (as you mention); volounteers from beginning to end ('volounteers' in the sense, that although most joined more or less out of free will, some no doubt lived to regret that decision, but by then they had painted themselves into a corner).
    Whether award policy were more or less strict, I cant say.
    Their commanders seemed happy with them judging from reports.
    Further more, the artilley officer Christian Peder Kryssing (briefly commanding the 'Free Corps Danmark') ended the war as SS-Brigadeführer der Waffen SS and one of the highest ranking of the foreign volounteers (though several other non-Germans were at least as highly ranked or outranked him).
    Kryssing was a staunch conservative but not member of the Party.
    He paid the price for his political naivity (he got screwed by the government and army in Denmark in a shrewd 'Real Politik' move - he had asked permission to join the fighting on the Eastern Front. His house was raided and all evidence of this removed in the immediate aftermath of the liberation of Denmark. Official Denmark collaborated with the Germans big time, until they caught on to which way the war was swaying); Kryssing lost both sons on the Eastern Front, wife badly wounded in a Russian air raid as she served as a nurse in a field hospital tending the wounded, Kryssing himself severely wounded in the legs by Allied forces upon capture. He also served a number on years in prison.

  6. #15


    The farmer is a soldier and could be more efficient than a officer. You make an impossible comparation.... The child you mean could not be a soldier

  7. #16


    Remy, I've got a copy of the Kriegstagesbuch from Frikorps Danmark from August 1941 to April 1942, describing their training at Langenhorn and Treskau in detail if you are interested.

  8. #17


    Mauro, sounds interesting where can I find that study conducted by the Israelian army?

  9. #18


    The question is, what makes an "elite" military organization elite? And is one "elite" unite any more elite than another? And what about "elite," single specialty units; are they in a different category of "elite?" And then there is the question of how to describe a well trained, battle-hardened "regular" unit that performs well to exceptionally well, but lacks the glamour appeal that attends designated "elite" units. The term often used to describe such "regular" units is "crack." Does a "crack" unit become an "elite" unite after a period of time?
    Does the attention, favor, and privilege that the higher authority lavishes on a unit make it "elite" by setting it apart from the rest of the army?
    The SS was certainly lionized in the media and given special uniforms and sometimes special equipment that lent an air of favoritism, but does that constitute "elite?" There is no questioning that the SS fought well, but did they fight any better than troops who were not similarly indoctrinated and equipped? And Is the presence of an Esprit de Corps a prerequisite for being "elite?" If so, then the German Panzer Grenadiers and Paratroops who fought at Monte Cassino must be described as "elite." And by that standard, so must the Allied troops who fought there.
    So please tell me, what makes an "elite" military organization, "elite." Dwight

  10. #19


    Apropos books and such, the Bernd Wegener book on the Waffen SS is a fine one, and there is a new biography of Jochen Peiper out by a fine young scholar who is also a Bw officer, and it is first rate.
    I included it elsewhere.

    A study by an Israeli scholar that compares the U.S. Army and the Wehrmacht is that of Martin v. Creveld, Combat Power, which appeared in 1982 in English as a DoD financed study, and
    later in German. It is not the final word, by any means.

    There is a large literature on the Waffen SS that is historically useless, that is, it adds little of value other than glitter and apologia.

    Some of your do read serious books, and my comment was directed at such people.

    Otherwise, those only interested in the propaganda images do not need any books, since all the propaganda images are
    contained in the internet.

    Dr. Messimer's comments are also of merit and quite germane.
    damit, basta.

  11. #20


    I am sorry if I offended you or something Friedrich-Berthold. I thought you offered to provide some titles.

    Quote by Friedrich-Berthold View Post
    Also, if you seriously interested in education and training in German military, I can provide you with titles of note.
    And thanks Mads! I would love to read the Kriegstagesbuch from Frikorps Danmark from August 1941 to April 1942.

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