another fake HJ helmet ?

**DougB** · 03-06-2012, 10:50 PM

These are HJ uniforms and insignia. That said I cannot remember ever seeing a real one, with the possible exception of the one everyone mentions of Jims. I just cannot recall that one right off the top of my head.

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 03-06-2012 10:50 PM

We also buy and trade your items and full collections!

**Andrew** · 03-06-2012, 11:28 PM

Thanks Doug, i was hoping my eyes were not that bad. i do think the pic is period. and as you said Jim has an original. i can't imagen there was only one ? logic says if there was one, there must be more. right ? and like with luft and heer decals, there are vareations. the germans were not as consistant as some think. i watched a a few video's on line today about the HJ. it was period done. what struck me as strange , was one youth in a luft tunic with a tank destroyer badge on his arm, had what looks like a heer cap on with a straight wing eagle, rather than the typical luft eagle. i think i learned a few things i did not know today watching period footage of the HJ. just things i had not seen before. i think some things have little or no period pic's but are still real. things were not photographed with collectors in mind. some times we just get lucky with pictures from the time.
but to me the point of these threads is to discuss what we think or know in a friendly way. not just dismiss things out of hand with out some explenation. most of us have no idea who the person is that replys, or have any idea of their true knowledge. but in all honesty. some come across so poorly that it just dont matter what they might know. no one will really care because of the attitude given with the responce. some people need to check the arrogence at the door, so the rest of the friendly collectors dont find it as hostile as some other sites, that people just stop going to because of it. if you cant be a bit friendly or at least reasonable. i'll leave the rest of my thought to your imagination.
andrew

**DougB** · 03-06-2012, 11:40 PM

Hi Andrew

I hope my responses were not seen to be arrogant or egotistical, that was certainly not the intent. Bear in mind it is difficult to give a detailed explanation with each thread. Some work has to be done by the person inquiring as well. When I say "repro decal" what are the qualities a repro decal has that a real one does not one must ask oneself. For that information most of it is just a few mouse clicks away. For example, construction, ink thickness, lack of depth, and print methods are but a few that will easily distinguish a repro decal from real, as it does very easily in the case of this rather poor HJ decal. Also what must be understood is these rare decal types are hardly found because many were reissued as the war went on and most were recycled or simply destroyed post war. An example of this would be NSKK helmets. Few survived as it was a relatively small branch, most were reissues and not many are in collector hands today. Could an HJ helmet like the one in the photograph be out there in a veterans house or collection? Sure, but it would have to "pass the test" as it were of an authentic period construction and print. An example of this is the Danzig helmet posted here about 4 years ago. Never before seen and very rare in period photographs even. At first a healthy scepticism but in hand it proved to me at least it was period and authentic, with photos at 200x magnification to make the case. Today, that helmet is accepted as being the only Danzig M35 helmet to exist.

I hope this answers your questions in more detail.

Doug

**Eric Zentner** · 03-06-2012, 11:53 PM

Link to Jim's..................https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/steel...ight=hj+helmet..................

Eric

**DougB** · 03-07-2012, 12:19 AM

Thanks Eric. That one is totally different than the diamond shaped HJ insignia normally seen. I do like it!

**Andrew** · 03-07-2012, 12:20 AM

NO NO NO Doug my rant had nothing to do with you. i'm sorry if i came across wrong. it was a general thing. not for you. i had hoped i was clearer. i'm just in a mood lol. pay no mind to my ranting. you are giving decent answers. i hope you and others understand what i mean by friendly collecting, and being able to just communicate in a reasonable way, with out the just "its fake" . like you mention with decals. if so few of any one type exist. it is very difficult to find good clear examples to get the details needed to determin if it is fake or not. and with me and heer and luft decals. because there are a number of vareations, and not being a collector of them. if one comes along that is a well aged fake, i have trouble with them, i'm not to proud to say it either. i have collected ww2 german items for over 30 years, and i know enough to say, i still dont know squat. there are many things i just dont know. but a few i do. and i'm just looking to learn and share information with other collectors in a nice way. it is strange here at times. a guy posted a 1918 trench knife for opinions. two people said it was fake. with out any good cause. one reason was even rediculas. it was said that, the same company made table knives so this couldnt be made by them or it would be better quality. REALLY ? it's a knuckle duster not a damn kitchen table knife lol. i own one, so i had to help the guy out by posting mine. to show they match. but no one comes back and tells the guy yup you have a good one , like the one pictured. or any thing of the kind. people are very very quick to shoot things down with out good cause . but dont seem to bring them selfs to man up and admit when they are wrong. and we all are at times. so instead they leave a member thinking hes got junk when he has a good item. it has happend time and again. lol doug i'm a reasonable sort, right up untill others are not. but please dont take it as directed at you. i wont even get into how not perfect or consistant german quality control really was. they could not even be consistant with the RZM mark it self. lol i'll put the key board down now and go back to enjoying my Killians. if you were here Doug, i'd share them with you.
cheers
andrew

really need spell check lol

**Andrew** · 03-07-2012, 12:29 AM

cool Eric,
that is another style yet, from the period picture that John posted. same adler, but no shield. and it was out lined in white i think? i saw it while searching the net today. so many things we just dont know.

**Andrew** · 03-07-2012, 01:01 AM

Eric,
i went back and looked for that other helmet decal picture. it was posted on the forum here before by another member. hopefully its not a problem to post it again here just for refference. same adler, out lined in white ,no shield

**Eric Zentner** · 03-07-2012, 01:19 AM

Cool pic thanks for finding it for us. I would just love to own that lid.

Eric

**MrMosel** · 03-07-2012, 01:58 AM

I agree with most of the fellows, There were some odd things done to German helmet's during the war but as far as an HJ helmet goes it's just to unusual for my liking and like most things I would thing there would be a picture of one in a book somewhere but no such luck. I might add the decal is far to worn to pass my judging as an orig.