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Luftschutz M40 Beaded

Article about: by reneblacky Cheers Guys Thanks for the info. Quist only made M40's right up to the end yes? I think this one is a reject (difficult to photograph) for the reason pictured here and previous

  1. #31
    ?

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Rene i have the same book and although its a very good guide i think the explanations given are really open to interpretation, the fact that they state two theories exist but they are more inclined to believe that there would have been better methods to mark a defective shell is only an opinion but looking a bit deeper and into the mindset of the German military, i am more inclined to believe that they would want the helmet to look uniform in appearance but at the same time be completely recognisable as a defective shell only suitable for non combat usage, logically the only way to do this would be to alter the shape somehow, they couldnt do this by pressure on the sides nor the front or rear but by reducing the height of the shell in someway they could kill two birds with one stone, thereby saving money as well, bearing in mind that this book was produced in the early 80s i wonder if their opinions have altered over the years

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  3. #32
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    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Either way they are a lovely variation, and one I need in my collection

  4. #33

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    any way mine looks like it was over rolled on the lip as pictured and out of all of the 18 odd combat shells I've owned, I've never seen this and I see no one has comented of this flaw - that's all I can say
    Last edited by reneblacky; 01-31-2012 at 09:41 AM. Reason: added text
    Regards
    René

  5. #34

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Cool thread fella's.Very interesting reading re the beading.
    Another super nice piece Rene.Good on ya mate.

  6. #35

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Here's a couple of close shots of the decal for reference
    Regards
    René

  7. #36

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    I've never seen ADM of a LS decal before .

    Some beads are slightly angled if you have noticed, and some are on a flat plane. This fact might shed some light on the process used. There must be some old woman in Esslingen that made these things! I might just raid the phonebook and work on my German.
    If anyone has a micrometer measurements of the thickness of shells of identical maker/model/size lids would be interesting to review. My M35 Q LS is, I would estimate, about 30% thinner than my M40 Q combat (I don't yet have a Q 35 combat ) But it is otherwise finished to a good standard. Weight of bare no liner LS shells would be useful also, we could build a database and analyse the data to put it to bed. Any obvious failures should be noted for each lid.

    Frustratingly, both theories could in reality be true; A set production line of beaded lids, with combat rejects tossed in from time to time due to failures.

  8. #37

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Ken Niewiarowicz subscribes to the combat reject theory, as did Ludwig Baer. I am inclined to agree with these two, who have researched the history of the steel helmet extensively, and have forgotten more about the stahlhelm in one day than I will ever know in a lifetime. I have 15 or 20 beaded lids, and the beads are not uniform at all in orientation - some are parallel to the apron, some slope up from the front, some slope down. This suggests to me that were were not rigid quality control measures employed when the beads were crimped in to the shells, and why would there be if these were rejects that were going to be surplussed to be sold to members of the paramilitary organizations who were required to purchase their own equipment? Until I am told that there was a contract that specified that combat shaped shells were to be produced with a bead, I will continue to adhere to the reject theory. Just my opinion. Jim G.

  9. #38

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Quote by KradSpam View Post
    I've never seen ADM of a LS decal before .

    Some beads are slightly angled if you have noticed, and some are on a flat plane. This fact might shed some light on the process used. There must be some old woman in Esslingen that made these things! I might just raid the phonebook and work on my German.
    If anyone has a micrometer measurements of the thickness of shells of identical maker/model/size lids would be interesting to review. My M35 Q LS is, I would estimate, about 30% thinner than my M40 Q combat (I don't yet have a Q 35 combat ) But it is otherwise finished to a good standard. Weight of bare no liner LS shells would be useful also, we could build a database and analyse the data to put it to bed. Any obvious failures should be noted for each lid.

    Frustratingly, both theories could in reality be true; A set production line of beaded lids, with combat rejects tossed in from time to time due to failures.
    Regarding the gauge of the metal, I wouldn't think that it would prove one theory versus the other. Many of my beaded lids have obvious defects that would render them unfit for combat use. Some do not have such obvious defects. If on these there are differences in the gauge of the steel, i.e. the steel on the beaded lid is thinner than its non beaded counterpart, this itself may be the defect, as a thinner shell would have less ballistic integrity. Again, just my opinion. Jim G.

  10. #39

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    I see your point on the thickness Jim. My idea was that if the tolerance was observed to be within a very small range for identical helmets, it would point to this tolerance being the intended thickness for these models. I of course respect the opinions of Baer et al but it never hurts to discuss

    On a side note, I think these things are undervalued, they have one of the best looking decals IMO

  11. #40

    Default Re: Luftschutz M40 Beaded

    Quote by KradSpam View Post
    I see your point on the thickness Jim. My idea was that if the tolerance was observed to be within a very small range for identical helmets, it would point to this tolerance being the intended thickness for these models. I of course respect the opinions of Baer et al but it never hurts to discuss

    On a side note, I think these things are undervalued, they have one of the best looking decals IMO
    Agreed! Jim G.

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