Sister helmets

[ObKrieger]

Hi guys,

I was thinking earlier about the whole lot number system. I think it would be neat to see some 'sister helmets'. Do any of you have helmets that are from the same factory and lot?

Here are just a couple of mine. Let me know if any of you have a matching helmet. It would be cool to see the comparisons.

Q62 DN137 (SD Heer M40)
ET66 1297 (SD KM M40)
EF62 22426 (SD Heer M40)
ET68 491 (SD Heer M40)

[DougB]

I do not have any matches to yours but I know of a lot of doubles, some triples and even quadruples.

Here are two matching sets of helmets.

The blackies are both Q M35's lot number 1151. There are 2 more out there in distinguished collections. My two are here shown with one of my SS daggers.

Attachment 174837

The other two I have are not lot number twins but are very very close. However, they are identical re-issues that must have been done at the exact same time, they have identical matching paint, identical re-issue Pocher decals which were put on with the same slight off center points, the same crazing of the paint over the SS decals underneath. In fact these helmets visually are identical twins and are off in lot number by only about 15 or so.

Attachment 174836

I own an LAH Fat Runes SS ET M35 that has 2 others with identical lot numbers owned by Kelly Hicks, and I know there are 2 more out there with lot numbers 1 and 2 off.

I love seeing twin helmets in identical collections. It is cool to see them reunited after so many years.

[LondonJay]

Great displays Doug
Jay

[ShaneH]

i have a m40 se66 (7730) and i found a photo of a Heer m40 se66 last week with the same lot number

[ObKrieger]

Very nice helmets Doug.

How many helmets are there in a batch? I think there are about 100 of each lot number, correct?

[FranzJon]

great EYE CANDY!

I do not have any matches to yours but I know of a lot of doubles, some triples and even quadruples.

Here are two matching sets of helmets.

The blackies are both Q M35's lot number 1151. There are 2 more out there in distinguished collections. My two are here shown with one of my SS daggers.

Attachment 174837

The other two I have are not lot number twins but are very very close. However, they are identical re-issues that must have been done at the exact same time, they have identical matching paint, identical re-issue Pocher decals which were put on with the same slight off center points, the same crazing of the paint over the SS decals underneath. In fact these helmets visually are identical twins and are off in lot number by only about 15 or so.

Attachment 174836

I own an LAH Fat Runes SS ET M35 that has 2 others with identical lot numbers owned by Kelly Hicks, and I know there are 2 more out there with lot numbers 1 and 2 off.

I love seeing twin helmets in identical collections. It is cool to see them reunited after so many years.

[DougB]

Very nice helmets Doug.

How many helmets are there in a batch? I think there are about 100 of each lot number, correct?

I do not think there is any proof to how many helmets made up a batch. I feel that the batch numbers represent steel plate numbers so the helmet manufacturers could go back to their supplier if any of the steel plate was found poor and did not represent a "batch" of helmets in the truest sense of the word. On GHW a thread was coincidentally started that show 2 Q M40 helmets, 2 sizes one a LW and one an SS. I found that rather interesting and supporting the steel plate theory vs a "batch" or lot of helmets. ALso the helmets were not necessarily stamped in sequence either but as plate manufacturers would ship out steel plate to the helmet manufacturers their sequences would invariably "rise". Just a theory based on manufacturing and the need for quality control and to identify quickly the source to a batch of steel.

[ObKrieger]

I do not think there is any proof to how many helmets made up a batch. I feel that the batch numbers represent steel plate numbers so the helmet manufacturers could go back to their supplier if any of the steel plate was found poor and did not represent a "batch" of helmets in the truest sense of the word. On GHW a thread was coincidentally started that show 2 Q M40 helmets, 2 sizes one a LW and one an SS. I found that rather interesting and supporting the steel plate theory vs a "batch" or lot of helmets. ALso the helmets were not necessarily stamped in sequence either but as plate manufacturers would ship out steel plate to the helmet manufacturers their sequences would invariably "rise". Just a theory based on manufacturing and the need for quality control and to identify quickly the source to a batch of steel.

I have never heard of this theory before but I like it. Do you think this could vary by manufacturer, though? For example, the DN, T, etc. prefixes found on later Quist shells, among others, are obviously specific to the helmet manufacturers themselves. Plus the fact that some manufacturers (namely, ET) have consecutive running lot numbers, so consistent that you can easily date an ET helmet to within a few months. Were there different steel mills that provided steel to each mill's respective helmet manufacturer?

[DougB]

Q lot numbers I think represent different manufacturing plants and don't run sequentially, they are all over the place. Early ET lot numbers start quite high and then "restart" for M35s nobody knows why. Is it EF I think runs into 5 digits. Each manufacturer will serialize their helmets differently as well, and I would imagine that various steel mills provided the steel from all across Europe once they occupied so much of it. The manufacturer like ET may have asked for sequential serializing, while others such as Q did not. Nobody knows for sure the answer but that is the fun of collecting. When anomalies pop up they can break conventional wisdom or cause paradigm shifts in thinking! But the speculation and research is a big part of the enjoyment.