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My latest eickhorn solingen säbel, but....

Article about: ....did they ever come with a nickel scabbard? I have never seen one before....

  1. #11

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  3. #12

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    Quote by 85ronnies View Post
    Here you go!

    sabel mit vernickelter scheide kosten mehr als mit emaillierter 160.......... translated =......saber with scabbard nickel cost more than with enamelled 160 RM
    cheers Ronnie

    hope this helps
    Ronnie, I'm fairly certain that it's just a typographical error, and that the original text probably reads something like 1.60 RM (that being closer to the cost of a new scabbard with either a black enamel or nickel finish). (And as you can see I had my own re-editing/changes to do). Best Regards, Fred

  4. #13

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    Quote by Frogprince View Post
    Ronnie, I'm certain that it's typographical error, and that the original text probably reads something like 1.60 RM. Best Regards, Fred
    Spot on F P but my type error sorry chaps

  5. #14
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    Thanks for the learning factor. As per the Heer Ordnance /Supply manual April 12,1940 reflects both for Enlisted & Officer saber that they be blued/black - no mention of silver??? Guess vendors did this for private purchase/Awards??

    Horst
    "He who hesitates is lost - is not only lost but miles from the next exit"

  6. #15

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    Quote by Horst View Post
    Thanks for the learning factor. As per the Heer Ordnance /Supply manual April 12,1940 reflects both for Enlisted & Officer saber that they be blued/black - no mention of silver??? Guess vendors did this for private purchase/Awards??

    Horst
    Horst, That seems to be correct for the period, with the standard factory government models for both the Officers (senior grade NCO's) and EM (reworked from the Prussian new model 1856 artillery sabers) having blued scabbards. With of course private purchase swords being another matter. Best Regards, Fred

  7. #16

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    Nickel was an added/extra cost as stated. although not many period photo's of them and also not sure about the reasoning for choosing nickel, besides the fact that it looks really snazzy lol. here is mine
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  8. #17
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    Have seen Imperial swords with nickel scabbards but not III Reich - I do think that regulations would dictate construction and eventual wear.

    Horst
    "He who hesitates is lost - is not only lost but miles from the next exit"

  9. #18

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    Quote by Horst View Post
    Thanks for the learning factor. As per the Heer Ordnance /Supply manual April 12,1940 reflects both for Enlisted & Officer saber that they be blued/black - no mention of silver??? Guess vendors did this for private purchase/Awards??

    Horst

    Have seen Imperial swords with nickel scabbards but not III Reich - I do think that regulations would dictate construction and eventual wear.

    Horst
    Horst, I understand your point of view, and don’t think that anyone would argue against the vast majority of TR period private purchase swords having black painted scabbards. But with the topic still under discussion think that it may require some kind of period proof to definitively come to a black only conclusion, especially as it seems to contradict published TR period information. With a good first step I think posting a copy of the Heer Ordnance/Supply manual that you mentioned above to see what other clues that it might have?

    As for the topic in general: Depending on the item and time sensitive - Imperial era sword scabbards were first polished steel, with bluing and nickel plating later on, followed by black paint (excluding the government models). While during the TR era the Luftwaffe and Kriegsmarine swords and daggers, and German Army (Heer) daggers were manufactured as relatively uniform models. (With of course many times some variables seen depending on the maker and time period, price etc. and the milspec items in a different category.)

    Which brings us back to the Germany Army swords that during the Imperial period traditionally varied with many different models. Not only as carried by the different German states, but also as used by the different service branches. Swords that were consolidated into fewer types during the Weimar era. With the known period information (besides the TR period catalogs) stating that unlike the other branches of the Wehrmacht many different styles or models of German Army Officer’s swords were offered (like different animal heads or without etc. etc.) - with buyers free to choose whatever suited their individual tastes. Also going so far as to state that some models were protected not by German Army regulations, but protected by patents by their makers so that no one else could copy them. My point being that if any regulations actually do exist as to what private purchase swords should look like - how would they address all of the many different variations that we know were manufactured? Best Regards, Fred 

    Last edited by Frogprince; 11-05-2015 at 07:33 PM. Reason: typo correction

  10. #19
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    Fred-

    As far as Im concerned this topic related only to Heer swords of the III Reich as shown in the original posting and from my perspective as stated above I have mainly only seen scabbards with a black finish- but based on the forgoing I would agree that there are III Reich Heer scabbards in nickel i.e awards/presentation,etc.
    The regulation I noted comes from John Angolia,s book"Edged Weaponry of the Third Reich" which he quotes and has a translation of same.He also brings out in his book "Swords of Germany 1900/1945"under saber/sword nomenclature that the III Reich Heer scabbard was usually finished in a black enamel paint.
    I only expressed my knowledge based on my observations over the past 50+ years and learning material/publications that relate to III Reich edge weapons published by seasoned and highly respected collectors of edge weapons.
    I imagine that if further research is needed there are various resources available i.e library of congress etc but for me this topic is closed.
    Horst
    "He who hesitates is lost - is not only lost but miles from the next exit"

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