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Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?

Article about: Hello Guys Got this interesting piece last week, taken from attic of an old house in South-East Poland, close to Ukrainian border. Surely that'a awartime piece,what's interesting made from b

  1. #1

    Default Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?

    Hello Guys
    Got this interesting piece last week, taken from attic of an old house in South-East Poland, close to Ukrainian border. Surely that'a awartime piece,what's interesting made from brown-green wool just like some officers M35s. Shape is terrible but there'sa chance of bringing it back to life.

    But, what do you think it actually is?

    For me "this"used to be officers M43 but at some time was modified by adding pre-war style collar and stitched shoulder boards. Also collar is far from Soviet style, flaps are shorter and lower edge is not straight but slightely bow-shaped. Two things came to my mind- VOHR and Polish army uniform collar. VOHR gymcollar indeed looks similar but still differs, there's no cut for collar hook like here but collar runs straight to frontal piece at 45 degrees angle, also flaps in VOHR tunic seemsto be shorter and has straight lower edge.

    Another thing are shoulder boards.First of all they were stitched, not removable as Soviet.

    Second is that both shoulder boards were 5cm wide, regular RKKA pagoni's were 6cm and 4cm for justice, administration and medical personel.

    Here once again came similarity to Polish insignia- Polish shoulder boards were usually 4,5-5cm wide.Also these red stripes with pieces of white thread looks like someone tried to make something similar looking to Polish pre-war NCO rank tape with red edges and white stripe in the middle.


    There is also a badge/award hole above right pocket,placed over it's left corner.Not a award probably as hole it too small and order would be rather worn in the middle but fits for guards badge for example and it's not one of tens moth holes on this blouse but has been made intetionaly.


    To me looks mostly like a gym that at some point was worn by NCO of Polish army formed in USSR,what also would suggest location of being found. Poles who found themselves living in territory occupied bu USSR between september 1939 and June 1941 were often drafted to Red Army (what would suggest trace of a Soviet badge),and then volunteered to 1st Polish Army created in late 1943.

    Thought that's still just my idea,maybe someone else has different idea? Would like to hear if you have some suggestions.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

    Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

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  3. #2

    Default

    One pocket has markings, numer, most likely 675 and some square stamp with text on it but unreadable.

    Coming back to my "Polish" theory, Polish pre-war NCO tape was 1cm wide, this is 8-9mm wide.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

    Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  


  4. #3

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    Now the most interesting part for me-collar. If it'sactually what I think then someone did a damn good job,collar looks almost like it's been there sime the gym was made (maybe except rought internal lower Edge).I like also lining of flaps underneath,never seen it in Soviet gyms.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

    Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

    Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

  5. #4

    Default

    Hello,

    What about m43 modified postwar for civilian use? Remember that the years after the war were very harsh times, people have to use what they have...

    The fabric seems to be British wool?

    Not a Vohr tunic in my opinion.

    Best regards,
    Gabriele

  6. #5

    Default

    But why civilian would wear shoulder boards?
    I mean, for sure this was worn after the war by civilian, have the same features as many other wartime Polish Peoples Army uniforms-cut of epaulettes and removed buttons. Also don’t think just simple civilian tailor would care to use the same materials as rest of gym to make a collar.

  7. #6

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    For comparison, collar of Polish Peoples Army uniform tunic made circa 1944-1946, based on pre-war Polish uniforms.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

  8. #7

    Default

    "But why civilian would wear shoulder boards?": shoulder boards were obviously used during the militay "life" of the gymnasterka, and removed when the owner became a civilian. The thread can be simply a reminiscence of the military time.

    Another hypothesys could be the theater.

    "Also don’t think just simple civilian tailor would care to use the same materials as rest of gym to make a collar." why not? Maybe it was available, it's just a little piece of cloth

    You are the expert of the polish tunic: compare the construction of the two and show to us

  9. #8

    Default

    Did my best
    In both cases shape is very characteristical for Polish uniform-the way it’s getting wider at the end and curved lower edge.
    Of course there are differences as both were made by simple tailors, not military workshop, but maybe in gym case who knows.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

    Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  

    Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?   Cutom modified gymnasterka M43?  


  10. #9

    Default

    Thank you for the pictures

    I like the idea of the tunic personalized for the polish volunteer of the red army: the collars of the tunics are indeed quite similar. But I am unable to tell if this was it's exact configuration during the war.

    In my opinion, this tunic was born as an m43, made of wool.
    What happened next, it's difficult to determine for me. Maybe you're right, it was initially modified by the owner to resemble the style of the polish uniform. Maybe the collar was added postwar, and the threads are simply the signs left by some kind of self-made pogonii.

    Anyway, I like it. I'll try to make some research about it.

  11. #10

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    In early existence of 1st Polish army soldiers and officers were geaven Gymnasterkas before they got based on pre war uniforms wz.43 tunics in July 1943. Most of them had just applied epaulettes but M43 gyms appeared through all wartime period of existence of Polish Army. Seen 1945 studio photo of soldier wearing M43 with applied collar, need to find it.

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