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M1 Helmet Help

Article about: by Walkwolf The chinstrap is a repro, IMO. Looks like a Norwegian chinstrap from the 60s Best regards from Norway

  1. #11

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    Quote by Walkwolf View Post

    The chinstrap is a repro, IMO.
    Looks like a Norwegian chinstrap from the 60s

    Best regards from Norway

  2. #12

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    Quote by Okie View Post
    The helmet appears to have the edge seam in the back which would make it post-WWII. The liner is also post-WWII, but pre-1956, because WWII liners have a small grommet hole in the front for attaching screwback insignia. They also had green painted webbing hardware, not black. The leather chin strap is an after market knock-off, not stitched correctly, and the wrong color. The helmet chin strap is a later 1950 version until the kevlar helmet. The helmet cover is from the 1960s to about 1980 when the woodland pattern was adopted. The black elastic band is just wrong and not G.I.
    Sorry, but there are all kinds of wrong in this reply. Rear seam doesn't necessarily mean post war. The rear seam was in production during the latter parts of the war and saw use. The helmet looks to have corking vs sand/silica, which if the case would make it wartime. Helmets produced in Korean war afterwards had the sand coating and the Nam era lids had a lower dome. Nothing unusual for wartime lids to see service into Nam and beyond with other countries. The helmet chinstraps are of the T-1 variety designed during the latter parts of WW2, and used on US helmets from Korea onwards until the late 70's-early 80's when the last design of chinstraps were fielded before the Kevlar. The last style had the chin cup and button snaps, with angled hooks for attachment to the bales.

    The liner is a POST 56 when the grommet was taken from the design, the webbing was a cotton tape vs HBT. This style, along with the earlier versions, were worn into Nam, and was eventually replaced by the cheaper nylon versions with the "X" style design in the webbing. The color of the liners material also changed at that time. And the WW2 liners had three different colors of hardware in them. Initial was plain "steel" look, without paint or any sort of rust prohibitor. Then the hardware was changed to an OD green, and finally, late war, to black. The webbing was initially a whitish/grey Rayon tape, then "Khaki" OD3 HBT webbing. The green OD7 HBT material is more commonly associated with the post war produced liners during Korea and after until the liners like this one were fielded.

    The liners chin strap, as indicated, is a "Euro clone", used and produced by one of the European countries. And the rubber around the lid itself , while not produced or issued,was something that was seen from the latter stages of WW2 ( mostly in the PTO) until Vietnam.

  3. #13
    ?

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    I admit I'm not a world-renowned helmet expert. I was just going by those I own and of those belonging to a collector/seller I know. I realize there are many insignificant variations to helmets over the years, but I was narrowing it down for the particular one in the pictures. BTW, I have Koren War and later liners with no grommets because they had none. Wartime stocks were used until the Korean War broke out then more things were made, some with changes (M-1951 combat clothing for example). As for what color the webbing is, those colors changed by dye lots and manufacturers and have no bearing on it just like with M-1941 jackets and a zillion other things. There are many variables even Sherlock Holmes would have trouble finding.
    Last edited by Okie; 11-06-2011 at 01:21 PM.

  4. #14

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    The helmet, in it's entirety, is likely pieced together but other than the liner chin strap, all looks M-1 like. The shell looks WWII, as Hoove pointed out, the photos show a distinct cork texture which ended with the war production helmets. As well, the liner is post 56 as Hoove has pointed out. As for the helmet band, this could be correct as it was common practice (mostly by the USMC I believe) to cut up rubber inner tubes and make into helmet bands. The biggest point made, in regards to the M-1, as as Hoove pointed out also, these lids were used from early in WWII on through to the 1980 so it would not be unusual to find a WWII shell with Korea or VN covers and hardware. Certainly some collectors might find this to be an inaccurate portrayal of an M-1 helmet but I find it just the opposite.

  5. #15

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    Quote by Okie View Post
    I admit I'm not a world-renowned helmet expert. I was just going by those I own and of those belonging to a collector/seller I know. I realize there are many insignificant variations to helmets over the years, but I was narrowing it down for the particular one in the pictures. BTW, I have Koren War and later liners with no grommets because they had none. Wartime stocks were used until the Korean War broke out then more things were made, some with changes (M-1951 combat clothing for example). As for what color the webbing is, those colors changed by dye lots and manufacturers and have no bearing on it just like with M-1941 jackets and a zillion other things. There are many variables even Sherlock Holmes would have trouble finding.
    And again, sorry. Some of your info is incorrect. And the "insignificant" variations are not quite so insignificant to collectors who only collect certain times, or want to portray certain era's. Korean War produced liners did indeed have the grommets, the colors and composition of the webbing has every bearing on the time frame. Granted, there are often variations in color within that time frame as you mention, and correct, wartime stocks used, then newer variations of uniforms and kit manufactured. Especially in uniforms. But in regards to helmets, it still doesn't change the fact that the earlier rayon tape, vs OD3 HBT vs the OD7 HBT vs the latter OD cotton tape make a world of difference. And Mr Holmes would have no problems in determining things after some studying, and experience of the US M1 helmet family.

    By the by, I am not attacking you personally. I don't know you and vice versa, but accurate info is extremely important. And sharing that knowledge allows others to learn, and also helps others from getting burnt and losing money to often not so scrupulous sellers.

  6. #16

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    Quote by MySonsDad View Post
    Certainly some collectors might find this to be an inaccurate portrayal of an M-1 helmet but I find it just the opposite.
    Dad, I wouldn't say some collectors would find it inaccurate. As it is accurate ( minus the euro clone chinstrap), for a certain time frame in regards to composition and look, but some collectors might pass it by, as they only focus on certain era's like WW2, of which it would then be inaccurate. Or not wholly original which is something others try to achieve, etc..

  7. #17

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    ok thanks for the info guys ! ,so what year would you say the shell is ? or what era ? ,also what era/war would you say the liner is ,also i brought a new liner strap a brown ww2 one looks great ,the real answer i want is what year it is or what era ? i know everything is gonna be a different era ? is the shell actually ww2 ?.thanks for the help guys

  8. #18
    ?

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    if you could please provide better pics it would be of great help if you're having trouble attaching pics send me a PM & I'll help you out

  9. #19

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    ok man its getting late where i am ill have some up tomorrow .the helmet camo also has some numbers and stuff on it can you identify what year it is with these ?

  10. #20
    ?

    Default Re: M1 Helmet Help

    yeah if you can include pics of that as well I'll be able to give a date.

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