Smle

**Michael Ryan** · 03-11-2017, 05:23 PM

Hi, My first time on this element of the Forum. I just thought that some of you "gun" people may be interested in a Short Magazine Lee Enfield rifle which I recently aquired. The weapon is deactivated and has a certificate to this effect. Any comments or opinions would be appreciated??

Please note I am also showing a Home Guard drill rifle under the equipment threads.

Regards Michael Ryan

SMLE 1917

**sargetom** · 03-11-2017, 05:34 PM

Great piece-Thanks for showing-I have one myself made in Australia in 1918-Sure has a kick!!

**Michael Ryan** · 03-11-2017, 05:48 PM

Hi Sargtom, Thank you for your comments. Having used these things as a personal weapon, I must agree!! They also hurt when you drop them on your foot!!!!

Cheers Michael (Sargemike). Yeh, I was one too!!

**Alex W** · 03-12-2017, 05:20 AM

Whilst its an Enfield and originally made in the UK, I believe this has seen service with Indian forces. The screw in the fore stock in picture two is usually indicative of this. Ishapore MkIII* - All About Enfields

Alex

**m3bobby** · 03-12-2017, 09:29 AM

That screw is known as the Isht screw however it's origins are not Indian. It was originally a British repair however it is more uduallly found on Indian owned Enfield No4s and Mk3s. They possibly fitted this screw as a modification to all rifles rather than as a repair as it was meant to be.

It also looks like the rifle or at least the woodwork has been to Australia too judging by the brass threaded wire.

**m3bobby** · 03-12-2017, 09:32 AM

Oh and the sling is fitted to the wrong swivel. The swivel on the nose cap is for the piling of arms. Move it back to the middle one to be correct.

**Michael Ryan** · 03-12-2017, 01:40 PM

Hi Alex and M3, Thank you very much for your points and conclusions. As you have probably guessed, I am not a firearms person and only took this item in to make weight in a trade with a friend. When I first aquired the item, the woodwork on the top did not match that of the underside and butt. To me it looked odd and probably replaced so purely as a matter of aesthetics, I polished the whole weapon in order to tone down the lighter woodwork and polish up the darker. Ergo, what you see, by way of finish, are two coates of polish. My opinion, without any knowledge of the subject, so in ignorance, is that this is a genuine weapon which has been repaired at some time in its history.

In order to try and educate myself, I will follow up on your link Alex. I will also amend the position of the strap M3bobby.

Thank you all once again. Any further comments are more than welcome.

Regards Michael R

**HARRY THE MOLE** · 03-12-2017, 02:56 PM

by m3bobby

It also looks like the rifle or at least the woodwork has been to Australia too judging by the brass threaded wire.

I am assuming that by this, you mean the threaded wire which goes through the stock just forward of the butt-socket. This was common to virtually all Lee-Enfields, there being a weak point in the stock in that area. It certainly cannot be used as proof of weapon - or woodwork, having been to Australia. My own SMLE, an example of the No1 Mk1***, also has this wire - as did every other SMLE I have owned over the years. The woodwork to my SMLE is totally original to the gun - and has been with it since it was originally built as a No 1 Mk1 in 1906.

**Michael Ryan** · 03-12-2017, 08:16 PM

Hi Harry, Thank you for your input. Please pardon my ignorance of this subject but if your rifle was produced in 1906 as a No1 Mk1, do you know what No and Mk mine is produced in 1917?

Cheers Michael

**HARRY THE MOLE** · 03-12-2017, 09:40 PM

Hi Michael, your rifle is a simplified version of the SMLE No1 Mk111... The Mk111 had long range volley sights fitted to the left side of the stock, a magazine cut-off plate, and a windage-adjustable rear sight. To increase production the rifle was simplified by omitting all these features, and that model became the Mk111*. There is a very good and informative website which will point you in the right direction in identifying the differences between the Mk111 and Mk111*... Type into your search engine the following... 'So you want a great war enfield? - 4thgordons.com.'... Avoid the website marked up for the 'Great War forum' and look for the one marked as a pdf file.

My own Mk1*** rifle started life as a No1 Mk1 in 1906. It had its first upgrade in 1908, and then in 1909,1910, and the last stamp is for 1911. It was further upgraded to Mk111 specification during the early part of the Great War at the Royal Naval ordnance depot. Very few of these rifles were fitted with the charger bridge, but my example is one that received that conversion - and this makes it an extremely rare rifle. It still has its volley sights and all its original woodwork from when it was a Mk1. The charger guide stop is still present on the right rear of the receiver, it has the early pattern magazine cut-off plate, the rear sling swivel is of the single screw-in post type which was converted by welding a fixing plate to it - and the magazine is the early pattern No 3 magazine. I have never fired the SMLE, although I won my marksmanship badge with a No4 as a 12 year-old army cadet. I was on the receiving end of gunfire from Lee Enfields in Northern Ireland during the early 1970's, where they were used to great effect by IRA terrorists.

Cheers,
Steve.