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German M92? And M62?

Article about: Hi Guys, I made a pig of myself and scooped up a whole bunch of gear today. I was only looking at some East German helmets, late period with sponge liners. They had 2 on offer but the biddin

  1. #1
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    Default German M92? And M62?

    Hi Guys,

    I made a pig of myself and scooped up a whole bunch of gear today.
    I was only looking at some East German helmets, late period with sponge liners.
    They had 2 on offer but the bidding got out of control, went far beyond what I would pay for them.
    So to sooth the loss I got these two.
    Am I correct identifying them as a M92 and M62?
    These are the only pics I have of them and I will need to wait till they arrive from Aussie before I can take better pics.

    I got a complete East German uniform and a massive pile a webbing I plan to use for hunting as a bonus buy.

    Cheers,

    Danger
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  


  2. #2

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    The correct naming of the Bundeswehr helmets isn't always as simple as we might prefer, partly because there's rarely any actual model number on the helmet itself. The left hand helmet, the composite, is a Schuberth 826, and while it has been called the M92 by some people I don't know if that was ever actually used by the Bundewehr. I believe it is best to go with 'B826', which does seem to have some 'official' connections, though you have to be careful to remember these were widely exported (sometimes in modified form) and have different designations in different countries..

    The steel helmets which preceded the 826 have a variety of designations, yours being either the M1A1 or M60, The problem here is that the first seems to be the more official designation but the second is used by some German collectors who might reasonably be expected to know what they're talking about.

    To tell the truth after thinking about this *I* don't think I know what I am talking about - it is that confusing. But I have all this from normally reliable sources, honest!, and I am a BW helmet collector in a small way. If someone better informed comes along we'll both be very grateful, I think.

  3. #3
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    Hi Greg,

    Thanks mate.
    I have been after an M60/M1A1 for a while, I've seen maybe 2 in the last 3 years come up for sale here in NZ.
    Again crazy prices.
    I will check and see what B826 has inside when it arrives.

    Cheers,

    Danger

  4. #4

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    You wil find some useful into on the 826 here - Composite Helmet, Ballistic helmets, Military helmets GERMANY, GERMAN 826 828 helmet, Kevlar helmet composite helmets index .

    If there is a comprehensive page on the M1A1 series in English I haven't found it yet. But there is an *excellent* French-language helmet website at World War Helmets - Reference de casques de 1915 a nos jours. which I wholeheartedly recommend. The section on the 'Modell 1A1' as *they choose to call it, is the most detailed I've found anywhere, You will have to register to get access (no problems or delay) and if your French is as poor as mine it is best to open it in Chrome if you can, and use Chrome's built in translator which is fine except for the most technical terms.

    There are also excellent threads on these helmets on the Wehrmacht Awards forum - for example The Bundeswehr M1 Helmet - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums

    And not to be forgotten here on WR - Bundeswehr steel helmets.

    And then you may discover the Austrian M58 and M75...Good luck!

  5. #5

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    Nice pairing Danger ,Many thanks to Greg for commenting also ,i have a few examples of the main model types of the Bundeswehr Steel helmet's so bear with me as i try to explain and put into words my thoughts but will most likely confuse myself in the process can i ask if you have looked over the internals of shell in greater detail on the M1 A1 as i feel you might have there a three point shell judging by the rear plastic apron on the liner so look behind that area for a redundant mounting bracket .I also notice an non standard looking US type chinstrap or perhaps a Nato M1 clone replacement strap of some sort and if i was to hazard a guess if it isn't US and judging by the shiny black hardware would say it would originally be more commonly found on the Norwegian m58 Perhaps , also to note Bundeswehr helmets had a break away catch in the two point chinstrap configuration and on the later models a paired of fixed and breakaway catches fitted as standard so your strap is definitely a replacement and non standard ,so depending on your findings looking over the shell we might learn more whether it is designated an M81 which had two point chinstrap and the rear plastic apron or if my hunch is right going off the Flecktarn cover and the size stamp visible in the front inner brim of the shell it might well be one of the last run steel helmets introduced known as the M85 ,a modified version of the Two point M81 but incorporating a three point chinstrap and introduced before the issue of the Gefechtshelm B826
    Regards James

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    Good point about the chinstrap, James. I hadn't really looked at it. You're obviously correct, it is not a normal issue strap.

    The thing about the 1981 liner with the nape strap might be a bit more difficult. It is entirely posible that a two-part strap helmet would have the modified liner fitted as a replaceement *without* have been properly converted to the three-point strap. It is just a simple swap, only the fitting of the three-point strap needed any real shop-work. But then again it is by far more likely that it is, as you guess, a full modification with the three-point attachments. And the wrong chnstrap.

    By the way, I have seen several (at least four) of the these M1A1 shells - two and three point strap with liners as expected - with *British* Mk4 elastic chinstraps. Now it seems unlikely to me that was a common BW practice (seems massively unlikely considering how much British troops hated that strap) or whether it is surplus dealers doing a bit of mix&match, the world may never know.

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    Hi James and Greg,

    Here are some new pics.
    They just arrived today.

    I also got a lucky dip of what looked like belts but turned out to be 3 sets of webbing and a US belt.
    The webbing is west German?
    One looks like wet weather/ winter and the other summer?
    The last one is fully kitted out with all you would need in the field.
    How old are these?
    Worth putting away or would I be forgiven for using one for hunting?
    I already have a rig, but I need a light weight rig for short hunts.

    Thanks for everyone advice and knowledge.

    Cheers,

    Danger
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  

    German M92? And M62?   German M92? And M62?  


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    Hi,

    Yes 3 point set up like you predicted.

    Thanks,

    Danger
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture German M92? And M62?  

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    Glad the helmets arrived Danger and thanks for the confirmation of that 3rd mounting point as i had a gut feeling there might be one present . Nice Load bearing rigs there mate I have a few West German Load bearing sets from the 70's upwards but can't see any similarities as much as i can tell without having in hand but wonder if yours is Australian or locally made in New Zealand perhaps but don't take my word as i am no expert on this gear , i see what looks to be a broad arrow marking present on most of the kit ,Do you know the origin of the kit yourself and it's just the harness yoke part of the your uncertain of ? i see some similarities to the US M56 Load carrying Equipment of the Vietnam war Era ,other than that i won't really be much help as my area of expertise leans more towards helmets than my limited knowledge in field gear ,Nice finds and thanks for sharing
    Last edited by James C; 05-10-2020 at 08:55 PM.
    Regards James

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