Need advise before trip to Germany to MD...

[dzyner]

Hi all,

First off, please direct me to the proper forum if this is not the appropriate place for this question. I've posted in other areas but either nobody is finding it or wants to reply. I know there are a ton of experienced folks in this forum so I'm hoping to get some opinions/guidance based on your experiences.

My two brothers and I are visiting Germany in a few months (June) for my older brother's 40th birthday and want to metal detect for a couple days while there. We're all WWII collectors, but the birthday boy is very much into Archeology as well, in fact I believe it was his college major.

The tour company we're using is hooking us up with a German local who will be taking us around for just this purpose. He's a gentleman they've been using for years and was in WWII (on the German side) at age 17...Hitler Youth... and knows his way around the battlefields.

My questions are...

Should we be concerned about legalities?

If so, what do we need to know or be aware of (besides the obvious... undetonated ammunition)?

Where are some of the best places to MD in your experience?

How do we get whatever we find back to the States?

You guys have been through this numerous times so your experience and advice is appreciated, more than you know! The last thing I want to do is go into this unprepared and end up in a German prison because I didn't ask questions first.

Thanks!
Dzyner

[Johnny-D]

To be honest mate, you need to contact the German authorities, or give your local German Embassy a call. That's the only way to get clear, and absolute clarification!

As a keen MD'er myself, I would throughly confirm the laws with the countries authorities rather than an Internet forum.

With all due respect to the members of this forum, but if one give you information that was slightly wrong or out of date, and you then got arrested in Germany, and fined, you'd blame this forum, when infact the onus is on you to clarify any queries with the Germany authorities!

Lee

[dzyner]

WoodyUK,

Thanks for the advice. I actually hadn't even considered inquiring with the local German Embassy. Great idea!

As for coming back and blaming the forum for bad advice... I think unfortunately we live in a time where too many people are incapable of taking responsibility for their own actions and decisions which creates paranoia, causing people to hold back in the advice category. Fortunately I'm not one of those people

I think your advice was perfect; contact my local Embassy. This points me in a direction I would not otherwise have thought of. If other members are uncomfortable answering the "legalities" part of my post, perhaps you have input like WoodyUK's, or thoughts on my last two questions?

Thanks again WoodyUK!
Dzyner

[Johnny-D]

Not a problem mate,

I probably didn't word my reply very well. Lol

What I meant was, advice from other members is certainly extremely useful, but the countries authorities are your safest bet regarding the digging, and bring back laws.

There's a few MD'ers on this site.... most FAR more knowledgable than me.... and I think they'd tell you to check with the embassy just to be on the safe side. Also ask for something in writing, signed by an official, and take it with you to Germany. It may be handy to get a copy in German too!

Very best of luck,
Lee

[Steve T]

Hey Dzyner

Ok, let's try and answer some of your questions.

Woody is absolutely correct about contacting the embassy. The laws change so frequently and affect different 'states' it really is a minefield. Get advice from them, and in WRITING. Take that with you when you go.

Some of the best places to search are now the worst. Despite the laws, many of the old battlefields have been illegally dug for the last 30 to 40 years, (e.g. The Hurtgen has more holes dug in it than the moon has craters), and you would be lucky to find so much as a cartridge case. The best advice I can give you is to get hold of some good in depth books on the individual battles that occurred in Germany and trawl through them with a fine tooth comb. A story I have told on numerous occasions on this forum is the one about the research I did for the Ardennes. In an obscure book was a one liner from a vet 'It took us 3 days to clear the Germans from the woods between 'village x' and 'village y''. I found the villages on google earth, saw that the wood still existed and marked it as a prime place to search. The woods were well away from the better known battlefields and were, consequently, full of stuff

As to bringing stuff back......nothing that contains any explosive of any description, including live cartridges. It is a 5 year mandatory term for trying to illegally take live ammo across an international border. Same goes for weapons, even if they have been in the ground for 65years. As for stuff that isn't explosive, you can take anything you want really. To most people it's just a hunk of rusty metal but to us it is gold ! The only thing you have to think about is the excess baggage charge you'll have to pay to get it back home. I'd take a spare suitcase just in case.

Hope this helps

Steve T

[Bigsieuk]

For what its worth I'd emphasise the risks too. I have personal experience of the local police in these situations and they arrest first and consider whether to drop charges after.

They do take M/D'ing very seriously, what we consider looking for relics they consider looking for firearms and explosives.

Objectively I can see both sides on this debate, as stated certain sites are full of M/D digging holes and some areas are war graves, with the soldiers still there. It is a shame that so many relics will deteriorate within the next 10 years as to not exist at all but to allow/encourage uncontrolled digging is part of the German Authourities justification.

Even though I know of areas where dreams are found I wouldn't risk going back again and getting caught.

Its not what we want to hear but its better than having an unplanned extended holiday paid for by the German State.

John

[Paul D]

For what its worth I'd emphasise the risks too. I have personal experience of the local police in these situations and they arrest first and consider whether to drop charges after.

They do take M/D'ing very seriously, what we consider looking for relics they consider looking for firearms and explosives.

Objectively I can see both sides on this debate, as stated certain sites are full of M/D digging holes and some areas are war graves, with the soldiers still there. It is a shame that so many relics will deteriorate within the next 10 years as to not exist at all but to allow/encourage uncontrolled digging is part of the German Authourities justification.

Even though I know of areas where dreams are found I wouldn't risk going back again and getting caught.

Its not what we want to hear but its better than having an unplanned extended holiday paid for by the German State.

John

Good advice well put John !!

[ssg keay]

Digging in Forests normally is illigal and when caught you can at a minimum loose your detector and worse see German prison bars from the inside. If you dig in fields, insure you have the owner's permission first. If you find a privately owned forest/woods, you might get permission from the owner, like I have gotten several times. The problem we run into over here are a crap-load of diggers that don't close the holes (some up to 6 foot down) and even worse, discard of explosives by laying them along the hiking trails. I guess the idea is, if they place it there, the first hiker seeing the damn bomb/grenade/shell etc will do the right thing and call the police/EOD. The problem is, quite a few people might actually see the object, but not know what it is and just ignore it. Last month a young child hiking in the woods with his elementary school teachers and class mates found a handgrenade someone left at the side of the path and the kid picked it up and when he got to the parking lot, someone noticed a big buldge in his pocket. Thank God nothing happened. Danny