Appraisals, Future of Hobby & Reproduction Factor

[Rossi]

Collectors,

I would love your opinions and thoughts. Take time to review and respond when you have a clean plate as I would really appreciate your sincere thoughts behind this post and thread. I am reserving my opinions and will read every response with appreciation. I am 110% certain all these questions have come up over a beer, coffee, at shows or in other threads. I also believe some have most likely rolled around in your minds multiple times.

Appraisals:

- Would you ever see the need for an appraisal of your collection?
- If so do you feel your knowledge is as of much value or more as the appraiser?
- Is it even worth it for you to consider?
- Do you have someone in your country that you find highly reputable you would recommend?
- With various militaria dealers setting retail bar prices how do you feel that might effect the appraisal?
- Could appraisal be done with photos or would pieces need to be in hand to provide accurate value placement?
- Do you insure your collections with a policy?


Future of hobby - Succession of your collection:

- Do you wonder where the next generation of collectors will come from?
- The forum helps educate but who will pass the passion to our children and their children?
- Will the millennial, gen x and gen y age brackets have a desire to preserve the hobby from an interest standpoint?
- How can we as a strong nucleus have more education webinars, presence at SOS and MAX and other gun and knife shows to educate, motivate and excite current and future collectors?
- With financial college loans and debt will they be willing to pay or even be able to break into this hobby?
- What will you do with your collection? Sell it for $$$ when you retire? Will to your family? Donate to a historical museum?


Fakes and Reproductions:

- How does the influx of fantasy pieces, fakes and quality reproductions effect value of real pieces?
- Does saturation and price point make a $75 fake appealing to a new collector versus a $600 authentic piece if it is close enough to the real thing as long as it seems to look like the real deal?
- Will the growth of these repros ultimately start to chip away at the asking price of the prize pieces we have strived so hard to preserve and search for? Will our values start to plummet over time?

Thanks in advance for your candid and open responses!

Rossi

[Rossi]

.....Please don't ban me for asking so many questions.....

[Ben Evans]

Hey Rossi

Just to kick you off I have just had all my Lugers appraised. I have had to have them insured as its getting to the point where if they got stolen there is an awful lot of money to lose. The appraisal was done by a good dealer friend of mine who has found a lot of my Lugers. He also specialises in Lugers and to be honest I have learnt a lot if good info from him. He sold me four of the Lugers so knew what I had, all the rest of my Lugers and holsters ect I have sent him pictures but he also knows I am very picky and if I am not sure myself I will have everything checked before I buy anything.

[Ben Evans]

In ref to fakes and reproductions I have seen some dealers who are actually unsure of what they have sell buckles for absolute peanuts so in that way it has aided the buyer. However with the high end fakes that are now around I actually believe that it has put some people off from collecting certain items as it is a very expensive mistake to make. On the other hand I also believe that some collectors cannot be bothered to learn about what they want to collect. If I was going to buy say a SS helmet as a one off I would ask Doug B to recommend one for me, if I was going to start collecting them I would study threads and start buying books. I am currently doing that with my Lugers at the moment, buying good reference books and reading threads on Gun Boards Luger forum as to learn and not depend on other guys.

[Larry C]

Hi Rossi ..great topic..which also I would like to include in your thread.."The Fear Of Mint" why people are so quick to condemn because it looks new. Not all TR regalia were found in half decent condition which was proven in many ways. I feel also that fear plays a huge roll in all 3 of your titles in your thread. Im not hijacking your thread..but this is also just as important ...of why people shy away from making any comments and reserving it for the well seasoned.

The final word just isnt reserved for the advanced..but also for the studied. If at anytime anyone feels this should not be included in this thread..I will remove my post and start a separate thread. Regards Larry

[Rossi]

Larry...I concur. LOVE IT! Also please leave this here in this thread. I used to have the FEAR of MINT and my Grandfather THE FEAR OF RELIC. My fear of MINT was not because my breath was bad either.

We would spar about MINT vs. RELIC condition often. He was more into a pristine Eickhorn or Paul Weyersberg dagger piece and would stick with the makers he knew. I understood because years ago before Wittmann and Johnson came with their books he only really knew a few makers when he went to Germany. I used to try to collect more salty pieces that had rare makers marks and might have a soldier's names or initials in them. Grit and grime was always cool to me. I would come home from an auction and he would kind of roll his eyes like what did you buy that roached buckle for? I would say "cuz it was $10 and smelled like gun powder and war". He would laugh and show me a near mint buckle and say but I bought this mint one for $30. So there We did agree on never cleaning pieces. We used to have over 1000 pieces in our collection. I still have 50 relic pieces in a bag that I was able to save from his "TRADING UP" Habit. I do appreciate what we have collected and what is proudly shown on our site. I believe he was looking to having a nice nest egg of great quality pieces to give to his grandson and teach me to look for high value pieces. I may throwup a new tab on my site called "Rossi's Relics" just because of your inspiration my friend and go anti mint for fun. Yes...I still get pumped to see mint but I also become more anal to inspect as a fake. THAT IS NOT GOOD! Mint is a great thing if authentic and I could be better to embrace it. Good lesson and food for thought Larry!

Seeing the value in both RELIC and MINT is important!

Rossi Out

[Neil Hever]

Hi folks, I think TR items will continue to hold and increase in value over time. Appraisals are kind of a dicey thing. Best bet would be to track what a similar item has sold for through a reputable seller. I wish there was something similar to Popsike for TR items. Popsike gathers data on records from actual realized prices. You can get a decent ballpark from those selling prices. I would make an average from high and low prices and note it. Not sure an appraiser can do much better. I am bothered by reproductions made in the 70s era. Many have age and patina that make them look 70 years old. You really have to do your homework. NH

[aurelius180]

Speaking for myself as a late generation x member, I have a desire to preserve these items and continue the hobby. I also use the term hobby loosely as I don't have as much interest in acquiring a multitude of items based on things such as maker. I do engage in the hoarding aspect of collecting but am completely happy acquiring a similar item from a less desirable/more common maker. I collect to preserve and hold an historical item. It's one thing to read a history book but the stories come alive a bit more when you can hold a period item that you own yourself.

As a newer collector I do find it frustrating to navigate through the multitude of fakes and reproductions. As such I would never consider adding a known reproduction to my collection by choice. I would most certainly save for the $600 item than acquire the $75 reproduction. Purchasing a reproduction would run counter to my reasons for collecting stated above. I also think that the fakes will not have a negative impact on the prices of real, original items.

I will say that websites such as this certainly helped me enter the hobby. This is a friendly, helpful website and I'm not sure I would have entered the hobby without it. After doing a bit of reading after my first purchase from an antique store a few years ago I started poking around and realized there are many more fakes than I would have expected and some other website are not as collegial.

As for the future of the hobby....I have a baby boy coming in February that I hope enjoys my collection and hobby as much s I do. I'll try anyway.

[Rossi]

Thanks Ed! Well put. I hope the new generation of collectors take your stance. I hope repros and fakes can continue to be exposed by the good people of the forum for all of our protection. Thanks for weighing in.

Speaking for myself as a late generation x member, I have a desire to preserve these items and continue the hobby. I also use the term hobby loosely as I don't have as much interest in acquiring a multitude of items based on things such as maker. I do engage in the hoarding aspect of collecting but am completely happy acquiring a similar item from a less desirable/more common maker. I collect to preserve and hold an historical item. It's one thing to read a history book but the stories come alive a bit more when you can hold a period item that you own yourself.

As a newer collector I do find it frustrating to navigate through the multitude of fakes and reproductions. As such I would never consider adding a known reproduction to my collection by choice. I would most certainly save for the $600 item than acquire the $75 reproduction. Purchasing a reproduction would run counter to my reasons for collecting stated above. I also think that the fakes will not have a negative impact on the prices of real, original items.

I will say that websites such as this certainly helped me enter the hobby. This is a friendly, helpful website and I'm not sure I would have entered the hobby without it. After doing a bit of reading after my first purchase from an antique store a few years ago I started poking around and realized there are many more fakes than I would have expected and some other website are not as collegial.

As for the future of the hobby....I have a baby boy coming in February that I hope enjoys my collection and hobby as much s I do. I'll try anyway.

[aurelius180]

Thanks Ed! Well put. I hope the new generation of collectors take your stance. I hope repros and fakes can continue to be exposed by the good people of the forum for all of our protection. Thanks for weighing in.

Thanks Rossi. It's definitely an interesting conversation and I look forward to hearing from some other, more advanced (than myself) collectors.