WW2 US Webbing - post your examples

[Danmark]

Hello all,
As I mentioned, I thought it might be nice to have a 'ONE STOP AREA' we could show the development and array of webbing the US issued to their troops during their involvement in WW2 ( 1942 – 1945 ) Not the actual ‘kit’ which we can deal with in a separate thread but the webbing itself.

This means the various belts, suspenders, packs, first aid pouches ( but not the Carlisle kit itself ), the different magazine pouches ( but not the magazines ) the water bottle covers ( but not the canteen or cup ) etc… Why, well this is how the Army treated it – as separate - and NO uniform parts please?
Let’s see if we can keep it on subject - Olive Drab US issued webbing.


But first - a word or two on ‘OLIVE DRAB’ ( OD )
During the war the US used TWO shades of olive drab for their webbing – OD#3 and OD#7 . Colloquially these have become known as ‘khaki’ and ‘green’ but that is actually incorrect as OD#3 is NOT khaki!

Khaki WAS a US shade ( called OD#9 ) and used for web gear but predated ww2 – and is predominantly beige & tan tones, not green ones. OD#3 should better be described as ‘Olive Tan’ and OD#7 as ‘Olive Green’. As I understand it, OD#3 was introduced in 1941 and OD#7 gradually from 1943 but all of them were mixed and used throughout the war years and images show that. Finally by late 1944 and into 1945, OD#7 was the only colour webbing issued.

Markings on Webbing – While many collectors strive to find clearly marked pieces of webbing, the truth is that many items of webbing that have seen field use have gotten wet or worn and the ink markings can be difficult to read. Even the large US on all webbing fades to nothing after time and hard use.
A good rule of thumb is that WW2 period markings are always only a maker name and date – multiple lines or stock numbers indicate post war contracts.


The images I will show are mostly of my items of webbing ( or will be when the postman arrives ) but there are a few items I have not yet found and so some images of typical examples will be used to illustrate the item. I am still a learner in this area so please correct me if I am a bit off ( but I have done some research )
My ( personal ) aim is that eventually I will be able to show the members a full webbing ensemble of each type ..... but that takes time!



That said, I’ll start with the M1936 pistol belt.

This issue in 1936 was a slight modification of the M-1912 belt with a more secure buckle. It was issued to all officers, tankers and men that either used a pistol, a M1 carbine, a submachine gun, or were medics - basically if you weren’t a rifleman with a M1 Garand you got this.

The belt had 3 rows of eyelets space 2 ¼” apart and all around the circumference – the top row was for the supporting harness, the bottom to hang equipment and the middle for the hook of the size adjustment. There was a snap at one end to locate a pouch and a blackened brass ( later a zinc alloy ) twist tongue and latch type buckle.


Example 1 – is in OD#3 with blackened brass latch and raw brass soldered loops
There is a really faint maker and date in the 4th photo at top and I think its 1943? as well as some larger inked numbers on the inside that I cannot decipher?







Example 2 – is in OD#7 webbing with blackened zinc alloy latch, ribbed steel loops ( alloy catches had the webs added for strength )
Undated that I can see, but probably 1944 or 45.

[Danmark]

The next belt you may find is the rifleman's M1 Garand cartridge belt - or correctly Belt, Cartridge, Cal .30, Dismounted, M-1923

The Model 1923 cartridge belt was adopted when stocks of the M-1910 belt were exhausted after World War I.
It provided ten pockets for clips of .30-caliber ammunition for the M-1903 Springfield, M-1917 Enfield, and later M1 Garand rifle.

The M-1903 and M-1917 rifles using 5 round stripper clips (two per pocket, total of 100 rounds) while the M1 Garand used a single eight shot clip per pocket (total 80 rounds). Each pocket had a pull tab and snap to secure the stripper clips but these were unnecessary for the en-bloc clip the Garand used. You may come across belts with these tabs removed ( as was commonplace in WW2 as it was just one more clip to undo when in a hurry! )


Example 1 in OD#3 ( not mine but I AM searching for a good example )
Note the strengthening gusset in the latch to indicate zinc alloy - brass versions were not webbed.






Example 2 in OD#7 ( this is actually a post war issue as the tabs were removed in 1949 but in ALL other aspects are the same as wartime )
also attached to this is a 2 pocket M1 carbine pouch ( I will address these later when we consider individual web pouches )






So, wartime issue identifiers are the pull tabs and snaps ( or just the snap base if the soldier removed the tab )

[earlymb]

... also attached to this is a 2 pocket M1 carbine pouch

Actually, this pouch was for either 2 8-rd M1 Garand blocs, or 2 M1 Carbine magazines.

I have a mountain of US WW2 webbing, I'll make some pics later.

[Danmark]

There IS another belt - the one issued for the BAR. But because I don't have one, maybe a member does and can show their example?

Meanwhile, I'd like to move onto the webbing items that were attached to these belts - firstly the issued FIRST AID POUCH.

Pouch, First Aid Packet, M-1942
One of the most common items of web gear issued for WW2 is the Pouch, First Aid Packet. This had one LTD ( lift-the-dot ) fastener designed to hold the Bandage, Carlisle, 1 each.

While not the subject of this thread, the Carlisle Dressing was originally packed in an OD metal box but can be found in red boxes. Later, the box was replaced by paper packaging. Designated 'First Aid Packet US Gov't Carlisle Model' this bandage was impregnated with sulfa and was large enough to handle almost any wound. All soldiers carried one.

They clipped into the lower row of eyelets on the pistol belt usually at the front to the left or right of the buckle or into the eyelets of the cartrige belt.


The first example is an OD#3 type dated 1943



As with all later webbing, the colour became OD#7 - here is an example in that shade from 1945 made by 'Independent Awnings'




Also the pouches were British made under contract - these had a snap closure instead and are marked 'British Made' on the inside flap.



Finally for the Pacific, there was a bigger version designed to hold insect repellent and water purification tablets among other items.
Here is an unissued 1944 example. ( Note that these have eyelets at the bottom so ANOTHER small Carlisle pack can be added as well )

[earlymb]

Here are some of my belts:



A M1937 BAR belt and 2 M1923 Rifle Belts. The BAR belt and top Rifle Belt are both made by Boyd and dated 1942, the bottom belt is also dated 1942 but the maker is unreadable. All are in very good to near mint condition. I also have a British Made M1923 belt, but I need to dig it up.




Markings on the Boyd belts. The bottom one is faint but readable.

I do feel this topic can get crowded quickly with all the different items being posted, maybe a separate thread for each subject (for example, a topic for the M1923 Rifle Belt alone) would be better?

[Danmark]

I do feel this topic can get crowded quickly with all the different items being posted, maybe a separate thread for each subject (for example, a topic for the M1923 Rifle Belt alone) would be better?

Good point friend, and I debated exactly that with myself - but I realised that as each thread gets commented on ( or not ) they become dispersed amongst the others in this sub-forum.

My idea was ( maybe a bit naive? ) that while as you say, it can be overwhelming in scope, at least this way everything would remain in the one place??
AND, if the moderators deemed it worthwhile, it could then be "stuck"

[Danmark]

Alrighty then ....... moving along, the next most common item of webbing ( well, sort of ) is the canteen cover. Used by every soldier and in pairs by the marines, it was the soldiers best friend after his firearm. Basically the WW1 design, the cover changed slightly for the second world war years, becoming slightly larger and getting 7 rows of stitching down the front. This is known ( by collectors ) as the model 1942.

The first example I have to show is this OD#3 Model 1942 cover. ( 1943 is stamped very lightly on the back at bottom ) You will see the early small web patch on the attachment hook, typical of this model.



The second example is the later war cover in OD#7 ( I cant see a date but probably 1944 or 45 ) and you will see the extra larger webbing hook reinforcement these have. This model was used into Korea until the M56 belt slider design came along.



BOTH do not show a US stamp on the front but these have been heavily used and wet / washed so the ink stamps ( which were water based and heat cured ) certainly fade into oblivion sometimes and may well have here. If they were never stamped it is because they were issued to the US Marines, not the US Army. Some collectors prefer the well marked items, but I have always preferred the combat used examples ....

[Danmark]

Moving onto the next most common item to be found attached to the belt, we have magazine pouches,

The first is the 2 pocket pouch for the 1911 colt 45 service pistol. Official government nomenclature was "Pocket, Magazine, Pistol M1918"



These had the male snap fitted to a sleeve which then slid onto the pistol belt and which was then snapped into position.

Made by L.C.C. & Co in 1918, these were used right through the war and on. This example is unused but has a secondary LCC stamp '54' which may be a reissue date?
There are a lot of these around, all in OD#3 and mostly by this same maker - they must have made 1000's!!

[Danmark]

The next pouch commonly encountered is the one for the M1 carbine magazines.
The carbine was developed in 1940/41 but not issued until early 1942 due to a protracted Army testing program, and the first pouches followed the early pouch design with the snap & loop attachment method - here is one example in OD#3



In time the design was modified or simplified to remove the snap and add two loops to the back so it could be slid onto the belt instead ( or anything else ) and multiples could be fitted, giving the carbine holder as much ammo as his M1 Garand wielding comrade!!

Here is a 1944 example in mixed OD#3 and OD#7 - note the eyelets at the bottom, another modification to allow the first aid pouch to be fitted instead of taking up room on the belt.



And one more - this time a 1945 version in FULL OD#7

[earlymb]

The early Carbine pouch with the snap will fit over the buttstock (and was often carried there), the second model can only be worn with the belt. Also, this model was intended for either 2 Carbine mags or 2 Garand clips.