General question on japanese pre Ww2 tunics

[unimoc]

Hi,
I am interested in japanese pre WW2 tunics. Bevore starting collecting there are some questions to answer.

In the book "Imperial Japanese Army and Navy. Uniforms and Equipment" you will find on page138, picture 463 a model 45 tunic. On the following side picture 464 and 465 is the same kind of tunic described as model 5. A mistake in the book?

Picture 464 and 465 are showing the same kind of tunic, one with and one without numbers on the collar. In which year these numbers hat to be removed?

On ebay I found two other tunics, produced around 1933. One looking like a m45 or m5 version for the chinese campaign? The other tunic has a collar similar to the war tunics. Was this tunic reworked or started production of these tunics in the early 1930s as a forerunner of the 1938 tunics?

When you find old style officers tunics (those with stand collar), is it possible to tell, from which period they are?

[Akira Komiya]

A Type 5 tunic and a later manufacture Type 45 tunic look identical from the front.
The difference is in the back; whereas the back of the Type 45 tunic is made of a single cloth panel, the back of the Type 5 tunic is made of 2 pieces of cloth joined by a central seam running the entire length of the back. This allows the tunic to be manufactured using smaller cloth panels, reducing wastage in the cutting process. I wrote “late manufacture Type 45 tunic” as the Type 45 tunic (and pants) underwent a few other changes during its lifetime (from 1912 to 1930).
The most obvious change that would be discernible from photos is that until 1922, the winter tunics had a red piping on the outer edge of the sleeves around cuff height and likewise, the winter issue trousers also had a red piping on the outer leg seams. The removal of the piping is said to be for the purposes of both reducing labor and improving the camouflage effect of the tunic, however, I believe the latter motive was stronger as even many unused garments in stock also had their pipings removed to comply with the order. Summer tunics and pants did not have the red piping and the summer weight tunics and pants that do have the piping are either for reservists or those issued by the army to soldiers sent home when their service time was cut short during the downsizing of the military in the early 20s. The latter have issue stampings so could be confusing to collectors but their format is different from ordinary tunics and the material is also thinner than the regular summer uniforms.
Also, the color of the garments were originally in a khaki with reddish undertones until 1920 when it was changed to the same khaki with bluish undertones as the Type 30 tunic. This was to reduce costs by switching to a domestically made pigment as well as to improve concealment; the initial khaki was based on the British khaki which was developed for use in the Indian subcontinent whereas the Japanese army’s primary intended theater of operations was mainly in China with different colored terrain. I can’t remember if the change took simultaneously with the color change, but at some point the method of dying the garments changed from dying the entire bolt of cloth khaki to creating the khaki color by weaving in different threads creating a somewhat mottled effect as also seen in German WW2 uniforms.
One change that occurred in 1918 was to enlarge the general fitting of the uniforms to make it more comfortable to the larger sized recruits; because of the downsizing of the army, they could now be pickier in their selection of conscripts resulting new coming recruits generally being larger than the previous generations. The uniform designation was changed at this time to the Type 45 (Revised) “改45式”. The last change was in 1926 when the buttons, braids and cap star insignia of soldiers in the medical and veterinary troops who previously used silver, was changed to gold just like those in the line branches.
The numerals on the collar flashes was omitted on field tunics for security reasons and it is not uncommon to see photos of enlisted tunics being worn without collar flashes, although there are photos showing the numerals being worn directly on the collar without collar flashes too.
I have not personally handled a tunic with modified roll collar but there was one recently on this forum. I don’t know if they were modified at the depot or were privately converted but many that you see today have had their bayonet loop removed suggesting civilian use. There are photos of soldiers wearing shoulder straps on tunics with roll collars which I believe are such modified tunics, although it is much more common to see the type 98 collar rank insignia on stand collar uniforms.

[ghp95134]

Great post, Akira-san. Hopefully Bruce will pin it to your growing file.

-- Guy

[Akira Komiya]

Guy-san:

Thank you for your kind words.
The last few days were a bit busy so I couldn’t chime in on the other threads which would have required me to open my PC, but now that I have a bit more time, will do so later.
Kindest regards,

Akira

[Bruce Pennington]

Done. Let me know if a different title would be more appropriate. "Development/differences of Type 5, Type 45, and Type 45 Revised Tunics".