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Short Development History of Type 95 Gunto

Article about: I do not collect edged weapons, but used to regard ground blades on bayonets and sabers as mostly post war mutilation, at least from the point of view of a collector. But ever since getting

  1. #211
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    Nick, you are spot on with your comments in post 194:
    Remember that the army spent a whole year figuring out how to clone Type 95s out of Type 32s, trying to make them look identical. We are talking about subtle differences in blade width and thickness. If collectors were not aware that there were clones out there, they would have simply been picked up as Type 95s.
    and further down:

    I bet they are lying around in collections unnoticed.

    (That being said, i personally think that these are a bit of a rarity and i would be interested to see how many others, if any, get discovered.)

    This got me thinking a bit, 'subtle' differences, and then after looking at some notes i had been given,
    i think i just may have found an example! And an Early Clone example at that (as per habiki).

    It will need verification from one of our very own forum members - Shamsy.
    Steve, Could you please provide some measurements of :
    1-Blade thickness, width and length.
    2-Bohi width
    3-A photo of the blade tip.

    If these are looking good, then, if you're feeling up to it .... to do a 'Bruce' and very carefully disassemble it, to take extra photo's of the whole blade, tang etc, and scabbard with measurements of throat to hanger and overall length.

    This will either prove or disprove what i think is a reasonable assumption, based on the info given here on the forum already and some photographic evidence previously supplied by Steve.
    Keep this photo in mind, and compare with those below - i had written Clone in those photo's but it should be 'Possible Clone'
    - Sorry, but i got a bit excited

    Short Development History of Type 95 Gunto

    Here are some photo's to consider.

    Short Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 Gunto
    Short Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 Gunto

  2. #212
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    I'd be happy to do some measurements and take some more photographs tomorrow of the sword.

    As a note for anyone interested, the sword Stegel is showing is an unusual one I've not quite placed before, as it has an odd mix of earlier model characteristics (open habaki and earlier ito pattern are the ones that spring to mind) and a few unique features. It is devoid of serial numbers or any kind of stamp. I was very careful when I first received it to make sure serial numbers have not been removed From the blade, as you will find that they sometimes are carefully filed down and sanded for whatever reason. Usually you can see this with the eye as a slight dip in the bkade. This sword was never stamped with a serial number.

    It certainly could be a clone, I'll not say that's impossible. It was subtly different to standard 95s, which is why Stegel and have discussed it prior to this information being made avaliable. We had hypothesised some sort of prototype or maybe transitioning model.

    As to disassembly.... I'll have a careful think about that. I'm not keen, but if I can do so without damage or forcing anything, I will do so.

  3. #213

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    Mail it to me, Steve, and I'll do it. That way you can honestly say you've never taken it apart! Ha!

    Seriously, can't wait to see the results!

  4. #214
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    Some unusual results. I went ahead and disassembled the sword. The screws were in great condition and other than a little rust and dried grease, they came apart pretty easily.

    Measurements are not the same as the Type 32. I've included pictures so you can see what each point measured.

    The blade does not have a Type 95 nakago. I found 3 stamps on the seppa and tsuba. Nagoya is obvious on the tsuba, the large seppa looks like Ko and maybe Ko on the small seppa?

    Unmarked otherwise. A real bitzer.

    Short Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 GuntoShort Development History of Type 95 Gunto

  5. #215
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    Thanks Steve,
    As suggested by another collector, it appears to be a Zohei-to, an Arsenal made sword.
    Well I was wrong with my thoughts, but it needed to be checked out. Thanks again
    So the hunt for converted Type32’s continues!

  6. #216

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    The blade does look like 造兵刀,but I can't see any arsenal mark on the tang.

  7. #217
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    The tang is entirely unmarked. It's a bit of an oddity really, not sure what I'd consider it to be, but it isn't a converted 32 sadly.

  8. #218

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    Yes,


    ko 小倉陸軍造兵廠監督課
    Kokura Army Arsenal Supervisory Section

  9. #219

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    The center of gravity was 95 cm away from the Tsuba for the clone, while 92 cm for the Type 95, so the suspension ring on the scabbard did need to be positioned lower on the clones to hang with the same balance.

  10. #220

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    Sorry if I'm beating the proverbial dead horse, but I had to compare my Otsu 32 with my Copper-95. It's noticeably longer and straighter. Like the diagram indicates, the saya must have been made specifically for the conversion (I had been assuming they used copper-handled saya, but they're too short and too curved. The 32 blade wouldn't go in more than half-way).

    The conversions must not have had serial numbers either. I don't see how they could have stamped one on that thin edge above the bohi.

    And like you've already said, my 32 measured 26.52mm.
    Click to enlarge the picture Click to enlarge the picture Short Development History of Type 95 Gunto   Short Development History of Type 95 Gunto  

    Short Development History of Type 95 Gunto   Short Development History of Type 95 Gunto  


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