M1910? mess tin / kochgeschirr - need identification

[DavK]

Hi!
I have these two mess tins. For me they look like the 1910 type Kochgeschirr. I heard that this type was used in ww1 at the army and after the war by nazi paramilitary units, even during ww2. There arent any markings visible. The main two differences are 1) one is about a 1 cm taller, but that longer part goes into the top part, so with the top part on there is no difference in height 2) the small metal hooks (I dont know what they are called) are different - se images. Both kits are made of aluminium, the smaller parts and handles are steel.

Is it possible to tell when these were made/used? Are there any differences between the ww1 and the post war/ww2 type?

[Verikauha]

Nice messkits. WW1 surpluss and possibly made more of these for 100,000 men strong Reichswehr in 1920-ties. Reichswer was increasen to 300,000 men in 1934.

But, there was messkit new models m/31 and m/42 which replaced this model, copies of those were made plentifully after war.

But butt, last m/1910 messkits are made in late 1930-ties and they are stamped like example black paint RZM M6/1/37 or green paint DMN 39.
Black painted ones are from 1930-ties.

Your green one is older, angular iron ears. Your other black messkit without stamp is from 1930-ties, notice how it has similar fat oval aluminium hook-carrier ears as m/31 messkit.
Ears are easiest to identify age.

Finnish army also made copies of this m/1910 messkits early 1920-ties, and have Finnish factory marking.

[Edward Lionheart]

Hello.
I would have said the exact opposite regarding which mess kit is the oldest : WW1 aluminium examples were painted black, just as the early mess kits of political formations, and then Feldgrau finally prevailed.
Regarding the steel handle fittings we must keep in mind that they are riveted : on WW1 mess tins I have seen so far they are mainly two ways of attaching them.
Early aluminium kits have riveted handle supports made of molded aluminium, ersatz mess kits have flat fittings directly welded on to the body of the enameled mess kit.
An aluminium mess kit with riveted steel fittings looks way more like a late WW2 type to me, and you can see how it looks like here : German mess kit war time or not

[Verikauha]

Interesting, you are correct about paint thing.

I did look more samples from internet. That oval aluminium fitting already existed in 1914 sample and painted black. But they have different distinct handle. Found 2 same sampels.
page link



And looks like steel fittings were more common in early variants. When we look more samples, oval aluminium fitting is minority, maybe only 1 manufacturer made them?

I think pre-1930 made used steel fittings prominently. Later all 1930-ties made samples used oval aluminium fittings, and they are stamped with maker and year.
Maybe only 1920-ties made samples are oly missing manufacturer/year stamps.

[Edward Lionheart]

To be more precise all aluminium M10 mess tins manufactured during WW1 I have seen so far have the molded aluminium handle fixations, whoever the manufacturer might be.
Those molded parts can be seen in mess kits by Wilhelm Berg, DWM German WWI M1910 Messkit, Kochgeschirr dated 1914 | #1695275768, Ullrich Das Kochgeschirr – The Mess Kit Part 1 | KB 2 Chevauleger Regiment and were already used on the 1893 mess kits.
They were standard on the Reichswehr 1927 mess kit Kochgeschirr Reichswehr / frühe Wehrmacht ESB 28, zusammengehöriges S, 50,00 € , and were logically back on both M31 mess kits and M10 SA, HJ and other political formations kits until they became unaffordable again.

[Edward Lionheart]

Hello again.
Regarding the time period to which these mess kits might belong it seems clear to me that the black one, being mostly made of aluminium but with a kind of handle that didn't appeared before 1917 is from around 1930.
The other one would require better pictures, and I can't help but thinking that the fact that there isn't any marking anywhere is unusal.