Pre-War 30s German (?) Unmarked 84/98 III Bayonet Sneak / Blanco / Behoerden / Export?
Article about: I recently acquired this bayonet and have been trying to track down it's possible origins. No markings can be found on the blade or pommel, the number 1 is stamped on the tang under the grip
Pre-War 30s German (?) Unmarked 84/98 III Bayonet Sneak / Blanco / Behoerden / Export?
I recently acquired this bayonet and have been trying to track down it's possible origins. No markings can be found on the blade or pommel, the number "1" is stamped on the tang under the grips and is also stamped on the lug press stud as is commonly found on German bayonets made during the 30s and very early 40s.
It appears that "1" is written in pencil on the backside of one of the grips. The cleaning rod cut-out on the tang is shaped differently than any other examples in my collection and the "oil hole" on the grips is blocked by the additional material present. No Waffenamt stamps can be found, no "Script O" on the spine. No serial numbers on the blade, crossguard or pommel.
The blade has a "rounded" spine, unlike the commonly encountered flat spines found on most German bayonets. The blade profile is similar to other early production blades I have on hand (the blade shown in comparison is a 1935 S/155K example that is unsharpened and clean) though there are differences that can be spotted. The unmarked example in question is slightly longer than a standard 84/98 III, with the crossguard being noticeably wider and the pommel having a slightly different profile as well.
The tang is also wider than the 1935 example shown. It will fit on a K98k rifle, though there is a modest amount of "wobble" that can be detected, none of my other examples display this trait. The scabbard that came with the bayonet is textbook 30s German construction but has no maker's stamp or serial numbers. However, the finial is stamped with what appears to be a "Droop Eagle" Waffenamt numbered 88, which could indicate production by Pack in 1935. The frog that was included is similar to German construction yet has no rivets, retention strap and no markings of any kind.
The leather is good quality but does not appear to be as thick as standard military issue examples and closer in profile to the type found with KS98 "dress" bayonets, though the material is much more substantial than those.
The inclusion of the leather spacer at the ricasso would seemingly point towards Spanish use, however the quality of fit and construction would not. It does not appear to be a Spanish made "M1943" or a Portuguese Contract "M1937." Could this be a early production example "Behoerden" 84/98 made for export? Or possibly an unmarked example destined for use by an internal civil branch like the Reichspost, Reichsbahn or even the Polizei? I would really appreciate any "light that could be shed" on this one as it has me thoroughly stumped!
Thank you for your reply Anderson. I have owned several Spanish made M43s and their construction was much less substantial than this example, could this be a German-made piece accepted into Spanish service? I was wondering if it might be a "Narrow Pattern" transitional bayonet, but it lacks the typical serial number stamps. The blade measures about 25.5 cm in length from crossguard to tip, the width is about 4-5 mm. I have never owned one of these "Narrow" blades and have nothing to compare this one too, what say you?
You are right most of the M-43 we see do have a narrower blade and usually other distinctive marks. But I don't think this is German made at all. It is based on a S84/98 with significant differences,( note the locking bolt is round at both ends rather than square at one end). But appears too well machined to be a "repro". The scabbard could be German made but we can't be sure they were always together. I'm thinking may be a prototype copy manufactured either at Spain or another country. Interesting piece.
Hello Komet..I " Deblocked " your post by separating into paragraphs in your post for easier comprehension for the readers.
I for one sometimes get lost in a huge block of words and sometimes am rereading over what I have already read.
All your content is still there
Regards Larry
It is not the size of a Collection in History that matters......Its the size of your Passion for it!! - Larry C
One never knows what tree roots push to the surface of what laid buried before the tree was planted - Larry C
“The farther back you can look, the farther forward you are likely to see.” - Winston Churchill
Pre-War 30s German (?) Unmarked 84/98 III Bayonet Sneak / Blanco / Behoerden / Export?
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