HJ Bowie Opinions

**nbushyager** · 06-14-2017, 01:41 AM

Hi guys. I am in discussion with a guy to possibly buy this knife. It's rough, but wondering everyones opinions on the authenticity and value. I can't seem to find one in a recent sales. I have my doubts about the markings on this knife, but like other aspects of it. Thanks everyone.

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 06-14-2017 01:41 AM

We also buy and trade your items and full collections!

**Gwar** · 06-14-2017, 02:07 AM

There are threads concerning this style of blade.. My personal opinion although not binding and with all due respect , As I am not a collector of such items and thus.. A battered and worn relic that was probably damaged at some time in it's life and ground / reshaped and still is non collector condition IMO
These are only my thoughts at a glance.. hope I am wrong... Cordially G

**Frogprince** · 06-14-2017, 02:17 AM

by Gwar

There are threads concerning this style of blade.. My personal opinion although not binding and with all due respect , As I am not a collector of such items and thus.. A battered and worn relic that was probably damaged at some time in it's life and ground / reshaped and still is non collector condition IMO
These are only my thoughts at a glance.. hope I am wrong... Cordially G

Regrettably my thoughts are parallel to the above. Reground / reshaped to a Bowie knife configuration - most likely IMO postwar. Best Regards, Fred

**nbushyager** · 06-14-2017, 02:20 AM

Thank you both for the insight. I may have missed something in the previous post, but I thought these bowie HJ knifes were made in 42-43? There have been some mint unissued ones posted on this site - were those later deemed fantasy?

Thanks for your insight so far G and Fred

**MAP** · 06-14-2017, 03:41 AM

The clip point profile of yours is (from the photos which are not of the complete blade/knife) different than others shown on the forum IMHO.

**warbuff** · 06-14-2017, 03:44 AM

I believe what they are saying is that this is a genuine HJ knife, however the blade has been ground down after the war rendering it in an uncollectable state to advanced collectors. I have restored a couple HJ knifes in the past, however this one, IMO, is too far gone. the scabbard is the only part that could be salvaged.

**Frogprince** · 06-14-2017, 07:38 AM

by nbushyager

Thank you both for the insight. I may have missed something in the previous post, but I thought these bowie HJ knifes were made in 42-43? There have been some mint unissued ones posted on this site - were those later deemed fantasy?

Thanks for your insight so far G and Fred

There are quite a few PW fantasy bowie styled blades in circulation now that are supposedly HJ, and based on what used to be called the "BDM" (Bund Deutscher Mädel) knife. The knife itself with no TR symbology and for girls not being much of an attraction for TR collectors. But at some point and possibly modified in Germany for sales to GI's - a hat pin type of emblem was added to the scabbard becoming a "DJ" knife that was a much better seller to anyone wanting a souvenir. That said, there is actual fresh physical evidence that emblems were and are still being added to the blank scabbards. And the unmarked little aluminum hilted knife that refused to die branched out to the circa 1980's "Party Day" knives. Still later multiple batches of the "Olympic" PW fake knives were made with discernible manufacturing differences having prices that have greatly exceeded the price of a legitimate period HJ/DJ knife. And then for the "variant" collectors there are all sorts of in-between types like the "Party Day" knives with stag grips or "HJ emblems", various "maker " markings and even an "RZM" variant etc. etc.

But the 'icing on the cake' is that for years all sorts of dealers and their like minded friends kept referring to a period Klaas catalog that had this pattern of a small hunting knife pictured in it. And their theory (like so many that have no verifiable or zero basis) was that Klaas was selling leftover stock after the war. But here is the problem: The early Klaas knives like many HJ/DJ knives all have iron/steel hilts. And Klaas did get a significant contract from if not a full co-belligerent a sympathetic Bulgaria that had its own Brannik youth organization - with all of the Klaas-Brannik knives also having iron/steel hilts that were made in the 1941-1942 time frame. !942 being the actual cutoff date for the RZM and other civilian sector series blade production, with a 1942 datable steep decline in the finished quality of military blades from Solingen for the Wehrmacht. And if there was some leftover stock from the Brannik contract it would have had magnetic hilts and the Klaas trademarked blades. There is more that can be said - but for now some pictures might help in visualizing what I've said so far. Best Regards, Fred

**gerrit** · 06-14-2017, 08:59 AM

Fred i had that Klaas catalogue in my hand some time ago, a friend of mine got it straight from the Klaas family, here a few shots.
He also has the Original knife.
Its a very little knife: total lenght 20.5cm, blade is 11.5cm.

The only accepted HJ Bowie knives are WKC made, and all have typical WKC parts ( look at the HJ sticky on top of this page)
Here the cataloque and Klaas knife Fred refered to:
Regards
Ger

**Anderson** · 06-14-2017, 01:57 PM

The knife never left the factory looking like that, so you have a modified knife that is actually in quite poor condition. As a buyer expect a significant discount because of that. Only an entry level collector would take that on, so should be priced accordingly.

**nbushyager** · 06-14-2017, 03:35 PM

Thank you for all in information guys. I really enjoyed the Klaas book image that came out of this thread. I haven't bought the knife so I'm not worried. I will pass up on the knife. I was thinking about offering the guy $50 due to the condition and guess what he wanted - $750. Wow - talk about out of touch. Again, thank you for the wisdom.