HJ fahertenmesser Hartkopf & Co Solingen

[BlackBox]

Hello,

I just picked this one up this morning.
Knife has seen better days but is nicely marked with solid red enamel diamond.
Thanks for taking a look and sharing opinions.

Kr
Peter

[Larry C]

Hi Peter it has been studied that later production period examples dating after 1940 ..some were seen with red opaque colored grip diamonds..the HJ Gents will confirm but a pinned thread below on the diamond variations.

Hitler Youth Knife Diamond Variations From 1933-1942

The knife itself is overly salty with issues of condition on the blade...the etch is correct !

Regards Larry

[BlackBox]

Hi Larry,
Thanks for the reply.

I went through the Diamond variations topic before, very interesting read!

I had never seen the Opaque Red Enamel diamond before, but seems to be correct, and as for the "saltyness", it adds a bit of character to the item, not planning on touching it or trying to clean it in any way.
First of all, not even sure there is a way to improve the look of the blade without ruining the etching or markings. so leave it as is.
On first sight, I see no red flags, so happy with the addition to my modest collection.

Am I correct when saying Hartkopf is one of the more uncommon makers?

[Larry C]

IMO I would say more so not as common with both the logo and RZM number

Regards Larry

[Anderson]

One of my favourite maker logo.

[Dean]

Thanks for posting your HJ knife. No red flags here... Yessir, a
Genuine transitional with the motto still, salty as it may be, it's definitely been there! And it's not a common maker to come across either! And I definitely agree, you gotta love that
Logo too!
I haven't actively collected for a little while now but, I haven't come across another Hartkopf & Co. Since I had one in my collection. Mine wasn't an HJ, though..it was an SA actually, believe it or not..

[BlackBox]

Thanks Dean,
very much appreciated.

[gerrit]

I have my reservations concerning the diamond.
In 1938 these were imo not even on the market, and so far all 1938 hartkopf diamonds are the standard ones either with gold or silver coloured frame.
To be sure its not a glued in one you can have a röntgen picture made sideways to see if this one has metal prongs or if its glued.
I guess it does not wiggle?

Ger,
here a few samples with the correct diamond, google a bit and you will find enough of these showing only these 2 variants.

[BlackBox]

Hi Gerrit,

Thanks for the reply.
My wife misplaced my X-ray scanner somewhere, can't seem to find it right away.

Diamond does not wiggle, but may I quote a post made by you in another thread:

" Seeing in the above posts the way some of the Diamonds are attached to the grip its easy to understand that lots of them do not wiggle at all.
If you have had a worker who seriously bended the prongs with force the Diamond could be tight as hell in the grip plate!
Thx for the pics Gents!
Ger "

As for the opaque or solid red enamel, that was used in plenty of other TR pins and badges very early on.
Endless discussion these red enamel diamonds.
Anyway, on this knife, the grips have not been messed with, rivets are good and wear is consistent all over the knife.


here's an RZM M113 L Christian Lauer Nürnberg for ref.

[gerrit]

Yes of course i know that lots dont wiggle.
IMO these diamonds with flat red did not existed in 1938 but came years later.
This type of diamond is also known for being heavily produced now a days and cost some 30 euro on miltaria321.com

Personally i prefer a standard diamond in a 1938 knife.

If it were a knife produced after 1940 this diamond had a small change.
I hope you will find your Xray device and get a shot on the diamond.
Anyway if your fine with the diamond then all is fine



Cheers
Ger