Luftwaffe forestry knife Waffen-Loesche Ch. A. W.

[Anderson]

I've been in touch with a German Forestry expert who spoke with other Forestry specialists and his comment to me was "none of them can claim the Waffen-Loesche knife to be Luftwaffe or connected to the Luftwaffe at all, at this moment."

Furthermore my contact said "the W-L knife resembles in ways the so called "Saufanger" or in some ways the "Standhauer" (a replacement for lower ranks and forestry students)."

What is clear is that the design is not unique, and has been present in German knife manufacturing for some considerable time prior to the Third Reich. While remaining focused on the Waffen-Loesche knife, I will post several photos of similar knives, that strengthen the idea that this knife was not unique in style. The tradition of combining a bayonet style blade with a stag horn grip was not unique to the Waffen-Loesche knife.

[Anderson]

Apologies for the photo quality, as these are copies of copies. but what we see here is an Imperial era hunting knife with a long "Carbine" blade, military style scabbard and frog and staghorn grip. In style an ancestor of the Waffen-loesche knife.

[Anderson]

Another hunting knife, late 19th century. Note the blade style and grip.

[Anderson]

A hunting knife by Eichhorn, again note the style of blade, scabbard, frog and grip.

We could mistakenly assume there must be a military connection. But this is a civilian private purchase knife.

[Anderson]

Another hunting knife with the "Carbine" blade just like the Waffen-Loesche knife. Where W-L differs is they have gone from a narrow tang with a screwed or peaned pommel top, to a full width tang with riveted grip plates. Simply an evolution of the "military style crossover" concept. That's probably enough examples (I have others) or I might irritate Larry!

Notice also the downward curving handle shape present in some of the horn grip hunting knives is borrowed and re-styled in the handle grip of the Waffen-Loesche knife.

[gerrit]

Anderson i think your simply are missing one thing and thats the design that makes it unique regardless what you show here.
In fact i think these knives shown here are off topic

The bayonet style blade has been used extensively in hirschfänger style hunting knives, thats very well known BUT they all have a tang hole in a full stag grip, making that a totally different desgin.
This Loesche knive design is very different in the way with it has a strong hilt thats attached to the tang and separate gripplates.

Unfortunate your talking to "forestry experst" has brought no results, no prove of LW design but nothing against it either.

I have posted the knive on a German Forum too on a thread about abrevement marking on LW blades.
Luftwaffe toolknives, gravity and fighting knives are well known for their LW abnahem-prove stamps, wether they used the stickbird or the S, and W.
These Loesche knives have in many (but not all) a spine marking = H
That could be a BAL- marking or a BA marking, one related to a unit the other one a prove marking:

"Es kann sich entweder um eine BAL-Abnahme handeln, dann ist der Buchstabe ein Kürzel für die Dienststelle, die Luftwaffen-Bauämter.... ähnlich den HZA
Es kann aber auch eine BA-Markierung sein, dann handelt es sich um eine Abnahme, welche in den jeweiligen Betrieben erfolgt ist....ähnlich der WaA."

Regards
Ger
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[Frogprince]

First my thanks for the hunting knives that were posted (they are outside my areas of interest) which I found interesting and a little troubling at the same time. Extra cost and possibly more fragile stag handled knives with a lanyard hole that is sometimes numbered as if an inventory of some kind (the topic starter). The only known authorized halfway comparable ones IMO being the very well documented German Police service bayonets (sidearms that may or may not fit on rifles). As for the “H” marking on the spine that was mentioned - that is seen on many Kar. 98k rifles representing the Heer (German Army). The known Luftwaffe rifles are marked differently as are the pistols etc. I’m also familiar with an “LBA” (Luftwaffe Bekleidungsamt) marking on Luftwaffe blade related items, but not a BAL or BA. And to some extent the Heereszeugämter, but quite sure how it’s being referenced.

I (finally) found some of my notes from years ago when portions of this topic were being discussed. The early RZM specifications spoke of a rust free steel - at that time it was called a “Chromstahl” having a fairly high percentage of chromium with nickel that is roughly similar to one of Krupp’s original stainless steel formulations. That being the reason I suggested that “Chromolit” (that is I believe is a proprietary trade name from Wingen) was possibly related to the chrome-nickel alloys that Wingen was presumably using. That said, chromium was also used (at lower levels) as a hardener for steels that are not rust free. One period non-blade example being that of the nickel-chromium steel alloys that were used in making the hardened steel helmets for the German Army in the millions. A time sensitive matter because it depended on the availability especially of the critical ores which were imported, and consequently the Germans also worked on some alternate solutions - not that it has a direct bearing on the topic. Best Regards, Fred

[Larry C]

That's probably enough examples (I have others) or I might irritate Larry!

Not at all Anderson..the thread is fruitful ..and educational covering all aspects from all who have contributed.... I do not consider any of this to be off topic. Sometimes to go from Point A to B ..detours are to be made through areas of relation.

Interesting parallel of the use of the carbine blade in your post #45 above .

Regards Larry

[gerrit]

The only thing these knives have in common is the blade style, other then that the design is completely different.
I cannot see how that contributes, or am i missing something, i think its a bit like comparing apples with peaches......

Ger

[Larry C]

The only thing these knives have in common is the blade style, other then that the design is completely different.
I cannot see how that contributes, or am i missing something, i think its a bit like comparing apples with peaches......

Ger

Apples and peaches are both fruit. The info remains on this thread