2 RAD unfinished belt buckles

[weller]

I never collected Officer or Leader buckles, not really my area. I do have an older interesting P&C thread. For collector reference - post #9:

Dj - pc kh28

[RH1941]

Well for $25 for both I got a good education. GARY . Thanks guys

[Ben Evans]

I must admit and a new fake to me. The scary part of it is the colour of the metal, they are getting good at getting the right colour and a lack of cast flaws. I will trawl around reenactor sites and see whats for sale!

[Wewelsburg]

It sure fooled me. As Ben stater, good colour.

[Gwar]

The only other point I can add is that the fakers usually use a concept / pattern / makers mark that was used and fashion their own unique spin on it to convince the unsuspecting buyer, from misspellings of the German language and makers marks on items that could not have existed on certain items.. Here is a genuine ( IMO ) R.A.D.w.J. broach produced by Paulmann & Crohn that has and identical marking..

[weller]

The only other point I can add is that the fakers usually use a concept / pattern / makers mark that was used and fashion their own unique spin on it to convince the unsuspecting buyer, from misspellings of the German language and makers marks on items that could not have existed on certain items.. Here is a genuine ( IMO ) R.A.D.w.J. broach produced by Paulmann & Crohn that has and identical marking..

You nailed that one, and it's an early maker mark. Not a stamping I have. Learn a bit more as we move along

[David North]

I am sorry Gwar, however and with all due respect, I disagree with you.

Never before have I heard the proposition that “…fakers usually use a concept/pattern/makers mark that was used and fashion their own unique spin on it to convince the unsuspecting buyer…”.

Perhaps I have misunderstood you and if so, please accept my apologies in advance.

I would suggest the contrary and in relation to some of the relatively newly surfaced fake Leaders buckles, those concerned and in my opinion, are making an extreme effort to replicate in every exact detail. Essentially, to produce a clone as essentially a perfect likeness of the original buckle.

They never do of course and there is always something accidentally incorrect, despite their best and often impressive endeavours.

By the way Gwar, I too think that the R.A.D.w.J brooch by Paulmann u. Crone that you have shown, is original.

Regards and best wishes,

David

[Gwar]

No problem David, Sometimes I guess my communication skills are a bit weary this week, I meant 'In General' like this RAD Hewer, the faker took it upon themselves to copy it, but alas they put the motto on the wrong side of the blade, so in a nutshell, they borrowed the concept but with poor execution and lack of knowledge on their part, like the RAD buckle with the horrible catch and RZM markings, including the Mutzenabzeichen which is also RZM marked, a BIG no-no if you will.. G

[David North]

Hello Gwar,

I now fully understand the point that you were making and with the examples that you show, I fully agree. These errors which I suppose are due to laziness, stupidity or a lack of homework, however more than likely a fortunate combination of all three, are thankfully now quickly recognised.

Buckles are of course not immune from these clumsy attempts to deceive, however amateurism is dangerously for some buckles, in decline. The relatively new wave of Leader’s buckles are perhaps a case in point.

Perhaps I am wrong, however I detect a very close eye for detail in these fake Leader’s buckles, although thankfully, there is always and without exception, something out of kilter.

I have been in private conversation with a mutual friend of ours and who is a recognised authority on many subjects to include the RAD.

It has been suggested and as you have previously mentioned, that the fake RAD Leader’s buckles being discussed here, sport a P u C logo which is inaccurate. I simply do not know, however if so, this supports your theory of the fakers adopting an artistic license and please, accept my apologies for suggesting otherwise.

Unfortunately I do not have digital images of sufficient size and quality to make a side by side comparison and I do not know if the logo in question was a single definitive or like other manufacturers, minor permutations and variations are known.

Regards and best wishes,

David