1937 Elite Diamant Bayonet

**Laconic** · 10-02-2021, 12:44 PM

Hello Everyone!
I recently have been asked whether I would be interested in acquiring a K98 bayonet from him. However, the price ( roughly USD600)was a lot higher than those I had purchased in the past. Nonetheless, the bayonet would indeed be a interesting addition to my own collection, since it is a pre-war 1937 S/185 (Elite Diamant) bayonet with matching numbers and a nice frog.
However, the seller is insistent on the price, claiming that the price originates from its low serial number, being the first 1,000 bayonets produced during 1937. Although this does sound reasonable, I am curious whether an Elite Diamant bayonet with such a serial number would constitute for such a price. I did remember that the rarity of a manufacturer would be a bigger factor in pricing, rather than its serial number being low or not.

Anyway, I would be more than glad and appreciative if anyone could give me some suggestions. Thank you!

I have added some photos below if anyone would like to provide any other suggestions.

**Espenlaub Militaria** · 10-02-2021 12:44 PM

We also buy and trade your items and full collections!

**Larry C** · 10-02-2021, 01:10 PM

Hello Laconic
In most cases with edged weapon types ...its rarity and desirability that would set the value. Which may be the case with a Diamant bayonet.

Yet there is also the over all condition that can mainly decide true value for the collector. These are the questions that The forums Bayo Gents can answer with precise answers.
They will be along shortly. Be Patient

Regards Larry

**Rossi** · 10-02-2021, 01:48 PM

Elite Diamant started 1937 production marking their pieces with the S/185 code but like many other makers transitioned to name trademarking in the later months of that year and later 1937 examples are marked with only Diamant. I believe but cannot confirm but they made likely 15k-20k bayonets in 1937. In 1938 they transitioned to the Elite Diamant name trademark. I cannot tell if blade has been heavily sharpened on the first photo. If so that would effect value. The bluing is there in some places and it is a been there piece. Overall, yes a harder to find early production bayonet by this maker. Low production matching numbers of 996 certainly help value. One rivet is missing from frog and scabbard has lost much of its finish.

In my years of collecting blades I look at a few things. Is it a want or a need? Does it need to fill a gap or hole in my collection? Do I really need it and am I willing to pay up? In this case you would need to decide if it is worth $600. Is this early 1937 that coveted? If you plan to never sell it and it is a need to have versus want to have then buy it and don’t look back.

I have seen these early 1937 Diamant sell between $375 and $450 depending on the rigs overall condition, serial number and if they are matching. I am not sure it commands $600 but again I am guilty of paying up for a minty piece, rare piece and if condition is hard to upgrade. I also remind myself. I am here now and it is here. When might I see this piece and have the chance to buy another like it.

Ahhhh! The collectors dilemma! Good luck on the purchase and whatever you do.

**Laconic** · 10-02-2021, 03:55 PM

Thank you, Rossi. Your speedy reply is greatly appreciated by a rather amateur collector such as I.
Likewise, my limited experience has usually seen those bayonets range from USD300 to USD450 at most. Thus, it is somewhat unsettling for me to see one go for such a hefty sum! I have considered that my current residence provides me a more limited selection when it comes to bayonet sellers, hence the additional expense, but it is nonetheless a substantial amount for such a piece.
If Elite Diamant did indeed manufacture 15k-20k bayonets in 1937, would such a quantity be regarded as high or low? I have tried looking for the production numbers of each year to no avail.
My purchases will be for my own personal collection, and therefore very unlikely to be sold again. Again, true to your word, I have considered the likelihood of me coming across such a piece in the future.

Ah, the dilemna!

**AndyB** · 10-02-2021, 04:47 PM

The bayonet itselft could be never reach so high value 600USD as the blade was heavily sharpened !! that decrease value to minimum -100USD probably, only GI connection of family could satisfied similar price, the S/185 is code for Diamant or later Elite Diamant and in 1937 they made about 20000 pcs before switch into Diamant production, so this would not satisfied similar price even in intact condition there are searched numbers in 1-10 range or max 1-100. What is on the set good, is the LW marked LBA frog even with 3 rivets missed here. It could be used by reenactor when not looking at sharpened blade.

**Frogprince** · 10-02-2021, 05:28 PM

by AndyB

The bayonet itselft could be never reach so high value 600USD as the blade was heavily sharpened !! that decrease value to minimum -100USD probably, only GI connection of family could satisfied similar price, the S/185 is code for Diamant or later Elite Diamant and in 1937 they made about 20000 pcs before switch into Diamant production, so this would not satisfied similar price even in intact condition there are searched numbers in 1-10 range or max 1-100. What is on the set good, is the LW marked LBA frog even with 3 rivets missed here. It could be used by reenactor when not looking at sharpened blade.

by Rossi

................................................

Ahhhh! The collectors dilemma! Good luck on the purchase and whatever you do.

I have faced the rarity, vs condition etc. etc. decisions on more than a few occasions. From my perspective more of a scarcer bayonet, I was advised a long time ago that when and if it became time to sell or trade something that the primary arguments I would face would be one after another on the "problems" that the item has. And prospective purchasers would keep hammering away on one defect after another. But if the item had CONDITION, CONDTION, CONDTION in its favor then the only thing that they could really argue about was the price. The bayonet here (significantly IMO) fails that test, and at a show (or with a dealers price list) personally I would walk away and just keep on looking. But that's just my opinion and others may see it differently. Best Regards, Fred

**Rossi** · 10-02-2021, 06:17 PM

by AndyB

The bayonet itselft could be never reach so high value 600USD as the blade was heavily sharpened !! that decrease value to minimum -100USD probably, only GI connection of family could satisfied similar price, the S/185 is code for Diamant or later Elite Diamant and in 1937 they made about 20000 pcs before switch into Diamant production, so this would not satisfied similar price even in intact condition there are searched numbers in 1-10 range or max 1-100. What is on the set good, is the LW marked LBA frog even with 3 rivets missed here. It could be used by reenactor when not looking at sharpened blade.

Sage advice and details from Fred and Andy. It Is always hard to tell another collector what to do. I think if you hold out for a better quality example you will be happier in the long run and not have regret. I did have my big screen up today and saw the picture enlarged of my concerns on the blade sharpening that Fred also spotted and I brought up last night.

**Anderson** · 10-03-2021, 12:20 AM

Some good advice here. I would only concur, overpriced and the serial number theory doesn't hold in my opinion. I'm in the same camp as Fred, condition is a much stronger influence on price for S84/98 and whether the scabbard matches the bayonet serial number. some lower volume makers might attract a slight premium, but condition and matching sets tend to be king. Post war refurbishments/usage also could also be a negative on price.

**Sleepwalker** · 10-03-2021, 10:26 AM

Hi there,

The set is original, with the same numbers but also worn accordingly. The horribly sharpened blade ruins the piece and makes it more of a specimen for collectors.

The serial number doesn't really play an important role in these vintages.

Elite Diamant S84 / 98 are generally a little rarer. But only in a really nice condition correspondingly higher quality.

Regards

**AndyB** · 10-03-2021, 01:47 PM

As already mentioned by all Expert here, the sharpening is a problem for bayonet collectors as a postwar change.
I would spare Your money for other matching piece, even in not extra nice condition but intact, matching and not sharpened. I know collectors that search for low numbers and would pay premium or search a special manufacturer. The price should be increased only by small amount not by hundreds USD as here.