Inherited SS Dagger

[Barry607]

Hi all, a friend has inherited an alladin's cave of military collectables following the recent sudden death of her uncle. Everything is being sorted and will eventually be sold. She has shown me this SS Dagger it looks legitimate to me but I know these are faked. Can anyone help with authentication?

[Rakkasan187]

Better pictures are needed for a better assessment.

You will need images of the blade, any hallmarks or markings, close ups of the grip, the chain,, basically photos that do not have the background disturbances.

Lay this on a table without all the items in the background

Smitty

[Adrian]

Agree with Smitty. A potential high end item that is heavily faked and messed with needs some good photos to enable the folk here to assess.
You will need clear and close up photos of many individual details.

[Rossi]

Better photos needed up close. Larry C will dissect it for you as well as others. Chain links look like they were repainted poorly unless it is pictures. Take better shots and it will help assess it. Also, check hanger leather to see if it is SS or RZM marked with stamp.

[Larry C]

Hi Barry welcome to the forum

Theres alot going on with this dagger.
First off the Chain itself is late production Type C
Scabbard is a recent repaint and should be the anodized type...and crucially someone painted the chain tabs and inside the Wotans knot with Black paint as Rossi pointed out.
A few of the SS rune tabs have been turned upside.

The lower guard to lower grip fit is poor showing a large gap on the right side and there also looks like there is a replacement screw on the right side of the upper scabbard fitting.

The Skull faces are totally worn down which on these Type Cs they hold onto their detail more so than Type A, B and B1 ( Early to Mid period Production.)

I would like to see the reverse side photo of the chain and its chain links straightened out flat.

In these limited detail photos...this dagger is messed with and parted together.
It would be hard to resell this in its current condition and altered state.

Please show close up photo of the reverse side of the chain,, the scabbard center ramp ,,. the grip runes button

Regards Larry

[Barry607]

Thank you all for your contributions in assessing this Dagger, I have very limited knowledge on these but although it looked OK to me I had my doubts. I will see if I can get her to provide clearer images.

[Barry607]

Here are some better pictures of the of the Dagger posted recently, I admit I don't know too much about these an personally think it could be a fake having now seen and handled it but that said I have never been up close to an original.

[Larry C]

Its amazing what great photos can produce and how it changes the direction in authenticity.
Without being in hand.....Clear and precise photos are all we have on these forums.

From what I can see and IMO ...I see a heavily worn Late production Type C chain ...that someone erroneously painted the tabs black
The dagger grip has had a repair to the lower left front side ...dont know when this was performed and could of happened who knows when.
The grip eagle and Runes button are heavily worn as well..I assume between the chain tab characters and the grip insignia...they were heavily cleaned post war.

The upper crossguard is the plated type seen on late production daggers including Chained SS daggers and the lower guard appears to be the early Nickel type.

The scabbard is a different story : The scabbard center ramp is an early production type seen on Type A or B1....yet the correct Type C chain links look unmessed with. How that got on there I dont know...but is not common to see that on a Late production Chained SS dagger.

There are details on a the center ramp that are too hard to explain here but if you compare a true Type C center ramp to a Type A or B1 ...seen here in this link in Post # 6 ...you will see the difference > Chained SS Study of the 4 Chain types

My Summation : ..All the fittings and components are Third Reich Produced ...but its not original to each other coming off the production. floor. Im seeing a mix and match between early and late production period...and would say these changes were made post war...OR...fitted together by a liberating GI or the Germans scraping together what they could to make some kind of income that the war has damaged their financial infrastructure.

The history is all there but pieces of it put together.
Thankyou Barry for the better photos

Regards Larry

[Barry607]

Thanks very much Larry for the expert detailed assessment of my post, I was thinking the whole thing might be a fake. The family of the deceased collector would like to thank for your help they have a massive collection to move on. The owners wanted most of the proceeds raised to a charity (RSPCA). Thank you once again.