Kragenspiegel SS-TV

[HussarII]

Dear all,

one simple question:

Has the Kragenspiegel (collar mirror/patch - sorry for my english) of the SS-Totenkopfverband ever or always been made by RZM licensed workshops?

thank you

[johanis1860]

The SS-Totenkopfverbände began to wear the distinctive Death’s head collar tabs sometime in 1935 until the end of the war
Reichszeugmeisterei (RZM) has controlled defined design, manufacturing and quality standards, from March 1933 until 1943, afterwards the SS-Führung itself took control.
So the collar tabs (Kragenspiegeln) were produced under the control of RZM and SS-Führung .
Regards,Jannis

[HussarII]

Dear jannis
thank you very much
i don't want to question your information, but do you have any proof or reference for me to read on there?
your information is very helpful to me.

can you help me with the question: what is it with the dachau made collar tab? i found many threads in this forum concerning dachau tabs.

[johanis1860]

Hello.
You can found infos at:
For the RZM :
Reichszeugmeisterei - Wikipedia
For SS-Führung:
The Collector's Guild
For Dachau debot:
Dachau Patches
For SS books:
SS Uniforms - PDF Free Download
Regards,Jannis.

[HussarII]

Dear jannis
thank you very much for the provided links.

I know the wiki link to RZM. One of the named authors in the references is my former prof.

the article by collector's guild contains historical mistakes. for example: the RZM was not established in june 1934. (sic) - furthermore the c.g. has an total opposite concept regarding vertical and horizontal in contrast to the information provided by robin lumsden

i now understand the term "dachau pattern" but what is the difference between this and the pattern shown by collector's guild

thank you for the book recommendation. i know books by mollo, saris, lumsden, and many more

[d'alquen]

The collar patches for the SS-Totenkopfverbände, at least until 1939 when the term was discontinued, were the most strictly controlled of all SS insignia. From 1935 Eicke specifically prohibited any sale or manufacture by private concerns. Orders were issued, as in a Max Simon Kommandanturbefehl from 1935, specifying that members of the SS-TV who had been dismissed had to return their patches and cuff titles. RZM listings of SS-TV insignia were restricted and there is much correspondence between Eicke and the Verwaltungsamt-SS regarding the restrictions surrounding the production and distribution of the badges for the SS-TV.
On another note, all the research I have done would indicate that no badges were actually produced at Dachau. it was a warehouse and distribution centre and the insignia stored there was produced by specialised insignia production companies.

[HussarII]

Dear D'alquen,
thank you for the information.
when SS-TV insignia was restricted- how can it be explained that badges attributed to the RZM are traded?

[d'alquen]

HussarII,
I'm sorry, but I don't quite understand your question. Can you re-phrase it?

[d'alquen]

I don't know if this answers your question but perhaps you were wondering about the restrictions regarding the distribution of the SS-TV collar patches. An Allgemeine-SS unit for example could order their insignia requirements from any local RZM approved retail shop or distributor. Each SS-TV unit could only order their required badges directly from the Verwaltungsamt-SS and the badges were supplied back to the units with copies of the invoices sent to Eicke.
Here is an entry from an August 1935 RZM bulletin that refers to an earlier listing of sleeve bands.

[HussarII]

dear d'alquen
that is exactly what i wa slooking for.
can you please tell me: when was this printed, issue, date, page?
sorry for my english - i appreciate your help very much!

one more question:

The local rzm shop had its own label with the individual identifier.

what did the rzm label look like at the verwaltungsamt-ss? or were the pieces delivered without a label, since they came directly from the rzm?

and one more (edit): Since the spring of 1935, the "verwaltungsamt-ss" was solely responsible and independent of the rZm. (kaienburg 2003, 124)
However, the rzm's newsletter still refers to the rzm.