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M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?

Article about: I was recently presented with this helmet by a friend, who told me that this helmet was labelled as an Austro-Hungarian M17 helmet that had undergone Finnish modifications. Truth be told, pr

  1. #1

    Default M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?

    I was recently presented with this helmet by a friend, who told me that this helmet was labelled as an Austro-Hungarian M17 helmet that had undergone Finnish modifications. Truth be told, prior to this event, I never really thought much about the Austro-Hungarian (AH for short) helmets, but was nonetheless intrigued by their stahlhelm.
    I did my best to read more about it and find pictures of comparison. However, I cannot say with confidence that I know what it is.
    Here are some pictures below as reference.

    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?
    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?

    Anyway, what really puzzled me was the placement of its rivets. As most photos show of AH helmets with two rivets, with one slightly higher on the helmet's skirt. As one can see from the photo, though there is a hole on the higher part, it is far too high than where the original rivet would go. I can only presume that the hole was a modification to install a liner.
    Yet, if that was a hole to install a liner, where did the original rivet for the chinstrap go? Since I cannot find any traces of removal or filling of a rivet hole alongside the helmet.

    Interestingly enough, the markings inside showed it as a W66, which I assume is correct, since the lugs atop the helmet are indeed in accordance to photos showing the lug as one piece instead of including a "step". Furthermore, peeking inside the dome I did see a serial number "R2007N".
    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?
    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?

    That said, though I originally thought it was not an AH helmet as proclaimed, would I be correct to assume that is instead a German M18 helmet?
    I'm pleased either way to be honest. However, I just want to know more clearly what I have at hand!

    Thank you!

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  3. #2
    MAP
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    You are correct. This is a GERMAN M18 shell and not an M17 Austrian shell.

    Hermann Weissenburger & Co., Stuttgart-Canstatt is the maker as evidenced by the "W" code.

    It is not in its original configuration having a replaced liner, split pins, chinstrap and paint. Further it appears that some sort of emblem was added based on the holes on each side of the helmet

    I will leave it up to others to confirm if it was a Finnish re-furb based on the changes made.
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  4. #3

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    Finnish used helmet, refurb. Interesting is that it isn't re-painted at depot and helmets original liner pins are used.

    Looks like Finnish pre-war dark-green paint, after war refurb paint is lighter grass-green color.

    1955 Finns made new liner (same as inside your helmet) for 50,000 german style helmets for 5 pins at home depot. Some helmets did crack from additional holes.
    Sometimes, rare chance, they just used 3 pins instead of 5.

    I have m/42 german helmet in original german feldgrau green color. It does have 5 holes, but has 3 pins only used with 1955 year liner.
    The liner doesn't have own model name

    Nice Winter war/Continuation war helmet.

  5. #4
    MAP
    MAP is offline
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    Quote by Verikauha View Post
    Finnish used helmet, refurb. Interesting is that it isn't re-painted at depot and helmets original liner pins are used.

    Looks like Finnish pre-war dark-green paint, after war refurb paint is lighter grass-green color.

    1955 Finns made new liner (same as inside your helmet) for 50,000 german style helmets for 5 pins at home depot. Some helmets did crack from additional holes.
    Sometimes, rare chance, they just used 3 pins instead of 5.

    I have m/42 german helmet in original german feldgrau green color. It does have 5 holes, but has 3 pins only used with 1955 year liner.
    The liner doesn't have own model name

    Nice Winter war/Continuation war helmet.
    Liner Pins look a bit large to my eyes to be original. Maybe Weissenburger used larger size pins than the other examples that I own.
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  6. #5

    Default

    I've seen too few helmets for now to actually distinguish color, so I'm pleased to know of this addition information that its color is of a pre-WWII color.
    The additional hole was definitely for a new liner, so I daresay it's a 5 pin liner M18 configured by the Fins. Thankfully, I did not see any cracks from the additional holes. I'll post additional photos of the liner below.

    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?
    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?
    M18 Helmet or Austrian-Hungarian M17?

    Apparently, the seller sold it as a Finnish configured Austro-Hungarian M17, however researching about it with what limited resources I had still had me puzzled by the differences in markings and such. Thankfully, with all your help I can be much more assure that is a German M18.
    Hmmm, that said, I might even consider buying a repro plate to add for display....
    Thank you!

  7. #6

    Default

    Stm short word in finnish means Sotamies = Soldier/private name S.Partonen
    74TJ... these TJ + number graffiti made by consripts are super common in Finnish garrisons. Usually in public, un-noticeable places.
    TJ= Tänään Käljellä, Today days left.
    Meaning: 74 service days left before Exemption from service.

    In my similar helmet, someone has filled those extra empty holes with lead, so it isn't noticeable at first glance.
    And about liner, changing it to new replica liner isn't going to make it any more original as it is now, Finnish refurb helmet. More likely to create oddity.
    Replica armor plate for display sounds nice.

  8. #7

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    I truly enjoy that titbit of information regarding Private Partonen. I definitely can relate to counting one's days remaining during military service.

    Truth be told, I originally did think of whether I should restore it to its original M18 configuration. Restoration of helmets to their origin country has always been something I found rather hard to decide. After some thought, I thought that this was a helmet that most probably saw service with some German soldier before changing to serve Finland. True, it may not be the more popularly-sought after M18s that retain their original look, or even those M18s that only have their shell remaining. But this M18 is like a 104 year veteran that has seen action under different flags.
    So I decided to retain it as it is.

    Initially, I did plan on placing it on a stand on the bookshelf. However, I can't help but take it off some time to admire. In addition, my wife wears it around the house for no apparent reason other than it amuses her.

    Last, Replica Stirnpanzer or armor plate is a lot harder to find than I had originally expected.

  9. #8

    Default

    Last thing I realized, that two brown stripe stain next to number 5.

    It is blood from bloody squashed mosquito

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