unknown helmet liner. Help is needed please

[skippyroo1]

I'm not sure if I'm posting this one under the right thread.

Here is for me an unknown liner. Which I have had for years. I could not find any
details about this liner.

The liner has a long rectangular forehead vent holes in it and I still don't know when they were first produced.

It has 1941 stamped twice and which looks like a NO.5 stamp on the leather. There are letters and NO.s. In a rectangular
stamping. NO.s. and letters as I Read it:

top: 12 - 77? 31 - 7891
Bottom: SW - L? XI/8

The leather is attached to the thin aluminium band with looks to me like a fishing line, But it has been there
for a very long long time. On the out side of the leather liner the fishing line has discoloured the same as the leather
on various sections.

The thin aluminium bad is secured by two aluminium clips that fit in the holes to be slide to the right to be fastened.
The side bands of the chin strap holder are made from aluminium too, just painted black.

The aluminium band is ca. 19mm wide and the thickness is almost two sheets of printing paper.

Two front holes seam to have been altered to fit an M35, M40 and so on split rivets. The two holes match perfectly
with an M40 helmet, but not the rear of the metal band, no big hole there. The dimension of the original holes are ca. 4mm

One thing for sure it is old.

I have searched up and down left and right, I could not find anything about this liner. I'm not even sure if it is German.
Looked into other countries, with no resault.

Any help would be honourably thankfull.

Regards
Skip

[reneblacky]

I dunno? West German to put it out there! none of my helmets have this -war time & post.

[MAP]

Do you have a photo of the whole liner? All we are seeing are bits and pieces.

At first glance, the perforations for venting to the leather lead me to believe it is maybe a civil liner.

But, I actually think it might be a post war BSG or police liner. I don't study these helmets so will wait for others to confirm. I always thought the chin strap bales were attached to these post war helmets and not the liner but there were a large number of variants . I've also never seen one of these post war liners out of a shell. So hard for me to comment on the construction of them.

The "1941" also throws me a bit. Not sure it is actually a date. Why? Post War BGS leather was sometimes stamped with an M-1943. Obviously though, this is stamped 1941 with a different style and font. But it does raise a question as to if it is a date.

See this thread. In post #1 it has what appears to be a post war BGS helmet with the liner stamped 1943. And in post #7, member Watchdog, posted another which has the same box stamped into his liner. But with different text.

Is this a West German Police or BGS Helmet?

And here is another thread

"M53" Bereitschaftspolizei Hamburg

Lastly, I see what looks like shrapnel damage to the liner band. Is that correct? Or are these the holes that you said were made to fit a war time helmet?

Edit: I posted an incorrect link. Fixed now.

[MAP]

OK....a bit more detective work.....

I'm now fairly sure that this is a post war BSG liner that was butchered to fit into a wartime helmet. Just a guess on my part so happy if someone sets me straight.

I think someone added the date, removed the liner attachment bands (that attach to the helmet), added the chin strap lugs (the black paint and poor workmanship is a red flag IMHO) and then tried to stick in a wartime helmet.

See this link. Match the rivets, liner band, slots, holes etc on your liner to the photos of this one....

German BGS M40/55 type ventless helmet. - German Helmets - Militaria Collectors Network

[Watchdog]

I agree with MAP that this is a heavily modified post-war German liner but at least one image of the whole thing is essential to be sure.
Regardless of what it actually is I would say that the extensive modifications have rendered it worthless as a collectible!

Regards

Mark