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Identification Assistance with German Sword

Article about: Hello, I am reaching out for expertise to help to identify what my son and I believe to be a German sword. I am taking a break from work at the moment and can take additional pictures of the

  1. #1

    Default Identification Assistance with German Sword

    Hello,

    I am reaching out for expertise to help to identify what my son and I believe to be a German sword.

    I am taking a break from work at the moment and can take additional pictures of the sword and scabbard this evening when I'm home.

    Here is what I've got for now...
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword

    We think it looks a lot like this imperial Carl Eickhorn sword.
    Wittmann Antique Militaria #34349 Imperial Shooting Guild Sword with Blue Panel

    The sword is quite worn and we do not see any indications (symbols, initials, trademark, etc) on the sword to help determine the maker. There are no numbers, dates, names, etc. that we can find on it. The langet with what appear to be crossed torches wrapped by ribbon (there is nothing discernible on the other langet) is really what has us stumped. We've learned that crossed cannons are artillery, crossed swords cavalry, etc. It makes me wonder if it is not like the sword in the link, perhaps the torches indicate a crest for a city. The blade has some interesting markings. There are etchings/engravings (??) on the blade on one side that includes items like flags, cannons, cannon balls, a drum and a horn, and a helmet. The other side is more worn and seems to have a decorative pattern with leaves, maybe vines, etc.

    Any thoughts are much appreciated.

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  3. #2
    MAP
    MAP is offline
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    Interesting sword. A number of members here should be able to help out. (I unfortunately can not). Please have some patience until the see this thread
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  4. #3

    Default

    Thanks, MAP.

    No worries about patience. I'm just happy I found a place that might be able to shed some light on this sword.

  5. #4

    Default

    Here are some better pics...

    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword
    Identification Assistance with German Sword

    The blade pics are interesting. The section with the ladder with the lamp post, staffs, helmet, drum and horn and maybe hammer(?) must signify something. As well as the section with the flags, hat, cannons, cannonballs, sword handle (?) and pike(?).

  6. #5

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    Almost certainly from the Imperial era - if I had to make a guess - it is that the sword was for a Fire Department official. Best Regards Fred

  7. #6
    MAP
    MAP is offline
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    Quote by Frogprince View Post
    Almost certainly from the Imperial era - if I had to make a guess - it is that the sword was for a Fire Department official. Best Regards Fred
    I guess the etched "Ladder" was the key clue? If I look closely, it also appears to have some Pikes as well as a Picklehaube with looks like a comb (comb being typical of fire helmets)

    I'm way out of my league here. Just random observations.
    "Please", Thank You" and proper manners appreciated

    My greatest fear is that one day I will die and my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them

    "Don't tell me these are investments if you never intend to sell anything" (Quote: Wife)

  8. #7

    Default

    Let's start with what we can be sure of. It is German, Solingen made, certainly pre-1905 and could date to late 1890's. It is a private purchase sword and while it is a military type, and some symbolism suggests military (crossed cannons), it could could be civil State organization related. It was possible to customize generic swords with personalized etchings. The two symbols of the crossed torches and the ladder and lamp are probably the key. I doubt Fire service and they had a specific non lion head sword type. I would suggest, either a military Signals unit or some sort of municipal authority leader's sword. The etching of the ladder and lamp makes me think of Lamplighters, which was a big civic organization in late 19th century. There may be other possibilities.

  9. #8

    Default

    I think Anderson hit the nail ,Good Job
    Nice and probably rare sword

  10. #9

    Default

    Lamplighters could be a possibility, there are also two torches shown right under the grip. These would have had no military connection though, so it is definilty a big question why a sword like this would have been made with these symbols. Maybe a gift? Does anyone know if someone non-military related could have bought this sword solely for himself?

    Also interesting to note, most of these Lionheads i have seen had curved blades and are thus säbel, while the blad on this one is straight, and looks rather like a degen.

    I agree that it has a close resemblence to the link you posted, maybe a certain model for the sale to civil organizations?

  11. #10

    Default

    Lamp lighters, a lost profession

    Identification Assistance with German Sword


    Private purchase swords were by definition not the property of the state and there was a wide latitude given on the type of "parade" sword a officer could purchase. We know that from the maker catalogues. The other aspect is to note is that the German states had a long tradition of wearing side arms and swords by various military and civic officials. This is one of those type swords I believe.

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