M1 front seam fixed bale vs front seam swivel bale

[Glittering_Ship4193]

Digging into M1 research it seems there is a lot of opinion on rear seam swivel bale helmets seeing action due to their late production date. In Chris Armold's Steel Pots on page 90, he has a footnote that states "There is considerable controversy among M1 helmet collectors about the position of the seam where the helmet rim joins. Although unable to locate any data from the period, I am convinced that the seam migrated from the front of the helmet to the rear in 1944 when the helmet rim material was changed.".

That aside, I'm curious as to what the community consensus is on front seam swivel bales in regards to collectability. Obviously this would be influenced by personal preference. On page 94 he notes that fixed bales were used from 1941-1943 with swivel being used approximately starting October 1943. Based on those dates and his estimated migration of the seam from the front to the rear, it is a reasonable assumption that front seam swivel bales potentially saw as much action as front seam fixed bale helmets.

Many collectors I have talked to suggest that an untouched front seam fixed bale is the most desirable. But it's my opinion that collecting front seam swivel bales doesn't make a collection any "less" as compared to others provided the helmet is also complete.

So I ask: Regarding front seam helmets only, which type of bale is your preference and why?

[Ethan]

I generally like fixed bale more because they have a good chance of being produced at an early time. I like swivel bales too, just less than fixed bale. For me an item having more likely or less likely seen action isn't as much an influence on my interest in the item. You can some-what use the heat stamp to judge when the time frame shell may have been made.

[Politefaun]

Eh the bales don't really matter that much to me, the only reason I choose to go for a fixed bail M1 for my WW2 display versus a swivel bail is that I already have an M1 WW2 swivel that was repainted for korea/vietnam. Honestly the paint and type of texture (cork vs sand) of it matter more to me as it's a much more visible characteristic that denotes the period the helmet was used in. At the end of the day we will never know if an item saw combat unless it comes with provenance, and people have different views on what makes something "more collectible" than other things so I wouldn't worry about that.

[Vincent]

Hello, I thought I read somewhere that swilvel bales actually came it use in Oct 44, much later than thought. Has anyone else heard this? I think it was on US Military forum but they are down right now so I can't find it.

[relicz]

For me, it all depends on the helmet and if there is associated provenance. Many helmets were reissued post WWII, in multiple configuration.

Although the vast majority of my M1's are FS FB, I have no issues with acquiring a quality SB, especially if there is associated provenance WWII, Korea, or Vietnam.

[Vincent]

Ok let me fix that,I think it was that the seam was moved to the rear in Oct44. Obviously there were helmets from Normandy with swivel bales.Vince

[Rakkasan187]

The US Militaria forum is up and running just fine.. They went through a software upgrade a few weeks back but its operational..

US MILITARIA COLLECTORS FORUM

Smitty

[PaddyD00]

In real “Helmets of the ETO” which showcases a smattering of M1s found on battlefields mainly across Europe in 44/45. I think over 100 helmets are shown. I believe all are fixed loops. Except 2 or 3 are swivel bales. So what does that tell us ? I think that tells me at least in the ETO soldiers more than not wore Fixed Loop helmets. Just interesting fun fact I saw. Either that or the authors HATE swivel bales. Haha
- Z

[Rescue190]

I thought the 'Helmets of the ETO' published that rear seams started in late 43. This makes sense to me. This thread has changed a couple of times. A swivel bale rear seam is also fine for D-Day but it would only be someone that was recently assigned to the units involved. It would not apply to those that have worn their helmet for two years. The replacement units coming in after D-day with new equipment would most like have swivel bales and some with rear seams. Just MHO
John

[reneblacky]

I thought the 'Helmets of the ETO' published that rear seams started in late 43. This makes sense to me. This thread has changed a couple of times. A swivel bale rear seam is also fine for D-Day but it would only be someone that was recently assigned to the units involved. It would not apply to those that have worn their helmet for two years. The replacement units coming in after D-day with new equipment would most like have swivel bales and some with rear seams. Just MHO
John

Spot on!