Espenlaub Militaria - Top
Display your banner here
Results 1 to 5 of 5

Italian M33 Helmet - Confused

Article about: Hello, Hoping someone can be of assistance. I have an Italian M33 Alpini (artillery) helmet with several markings. First is the '57' on the liner which I know is the circumference size. Seco

  1. #1
    Bromia
    ?

    Default Italian M33 Helmet - Confused

    Hello,

    Hoping someone can be of assistance.
    I have an Italian M33 Alpini (artillery) helmet with several markings.
    First is the '57' on the liner which I know is the circumference size.
    Secondly on the rim at the rear is stamped 'P5' which is apparently the production/batch number? 'P' referring to the Pignone factory in Florence?
    Next, on the leather liner stamped in red is 'AT' a 'Crown' and the number '7'. 'AT' referring to Arsenale Torino? Not sure about the '7'.

    Were the shells and liners manufactured in 2 separate factories or do I have a non-matching pair?
    Also can anybody shed any light on the 'A.S. 1936' stamped into the chinstrap and the meaning behind the number '32' on the Nappina? Battalion or Regiment I'm guessing.
    Lastly, is there anyway to work out the year of manufacture? Is it the year stamped into the chinstrap (1936)?
    Thank you in advance.

    Italian M33 Helmet - ConfusedItalian M33 Helmet - ConfusedItalian M33 Helmet - ConfusedItalian M33 Helmet - ConfusedItalian M33 Helmet - ConfusedItalian M33 Helmet - ConfusedItalian M33 Helmet - Confused

  2. #2

    Default

    There are several quite good threads on the Forum here that help untangle the confusing Italian M33 configurations. The information is out there,if you simply look through the articles on the Forum here. One you might want to take a read of is at: Italian M33 Helmet
    Another would be: Italian M33 helmet-1947-90
    And yet more: Italian helmets of WW2
    William

    "Much that once was, is lost. For none now live who remember it."

  3. #3

    Default

    Welcome Bromia,
    and congratulations for your preparation on the subject, essentially everything that you say is correct, I try to help if I can.
    This is a helmet M33 of early production, period from 1934 to 1936, with its original color light green gray semi-gloss, then with the beginning of the war for reasons of camouflage was issued the Circular Nr. 164 published in the Military Journal of June 17, 1940, which provided that all M33 had to be repainted in dark green-gray matt, but many of these helmets continued to be used in the first phase of the war with the original color.
    The nr. 57 indicates the size of the liner circumference.
    The P5 batch/number indicates a helmet probably produced by the manufacturer "Pignone in Florence."
    The stamp "AT7" inside the leather liner indicates that has been assembled by "Regio Esercito Arsenal of Turin", it is normal that there is a number, in this case "7", probably it indicates a period or an assembly division.
    The mark "A.S. 1936" on the chinstrap indicates the manufacturer "A. Sinigagliesi of Turin", known manufacturer of liners and chinstraps, of course 1936 is the year of production and corresponds perfectly to the rest of the helmet; I can not see from the photos, but the side without the buckle should have seven holes.
    The plume holder is a correct example of movable type, as expected by Circular Nr. 676 of August 28, 1940 and produced by "Arsenal of Turin".
    The flash "Alpina Artillery" is correct, is of the type painting with a brush, using a special mask produced from the Arsenal of Turin, in the circle it could be added to the regimental number.
    The "Nappina" is the correct type for "Alpina Artillery", with green oval and black inner, with the number in yellow color indicating the battery of belonging.
    The only thing that does not correspond are the back seams of the liner leather, for a helmet with this dating should be of the type with two parallel lines, the seam to "Z" was in use towards the end of the war and was then also used in the post-war period, however, there is nothing strange could be a replacement executed in the WW2 period.
    It would be interesting to check the color of the felt under the leather:
    -orange = WW2 period
    -light yellow = after the war.
    On the aluminum tab that holds the rectangular chinstrap supports could be the brand of "Arsenal of Turin", but it is not a rule.
    No clear images of aerators rivets, but considered the production period, in my opinion should be of the first type (convex form and with two tabs inside).
    Finally, to answer your question: shells, liners and chinstraps they were produced by different manufacturers and then assembled in the Arsenal, so it is normal that there is no correspondence between the components.
    Of course to say the last word should be done a live check to analyze the general level of aging, but from what I can see from the photos it is a good and very nice helmet.

    Regards
    Roberto
    Last edited by OldSteel; 01-08-2017 at 02:33 PM. Reason: add info

  4. #4
    Bromia
    ?

    Default

    Wow, awesome response.

    Thank you Wagriff, I referenced all threads relating to the M33 prior to my post. My questions were not covered adequately.
    Oldsteel, you are a legend!
    You have managed to answer all my questions in one reply. Thank you.
    I'm sure this will help not only me but loads of others as well.
    As Wagriff has stated the Italian M33 is a confusing model.

    Thanks again to the both of you.

  5. #5

    Default

    Thanks Bromia,
    it was a pleasure to help you and I hope that this information can be helpful to everyone, actually the knowledge of this good helmet is very complex and there is still a lot to say and to discover in my opinion.

    Regards
    Roberto

Similar Threads

  1. Confused in canada

    In History and Research Third Reich and WW2
    12-23-2016, 05:45 PM
  2. 03-30-2014, 03:15 AM
  3. RPG sight confused

    In Equipment, Accessories, & Personal Items
    06-30-2011, 01:35 PM
  4. I'm new and confused

    In Steel Helmets
    01-02-2011, 11:22 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Virtual Grenadier - Down
Display your banner here